Video Q&A with Jayce Loh of PointsNerd

Full Transcript

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ly-z8aXk9TY

[00:12] i love canada i love talking about canada so we welcome the canadian guest j slow of points nerd
[00:20] the canadian guest j slow of points nerd hi stefan thanks for having me well you
[00:23] hi stefan thanks for having me well you thank you for making time you've just taken on a
[00:25] taken on a a big new job and uh curious about all of that but uh by the profile picture you're showing it looks like you are a family traveler
[00:35] and a rogue warrior so tell tell us what your travel profile is
[00:39] uh yeah i mean typically um you know we we travel you know one or two times per year for big big trips um typically i'd like to take uh a month off and take a full trip
[00:53] and usually that means hitting as many continents as possible and as many new countries as possible uh you know we're trying to do uh what you do and then try to hit all the countries
[01:02] and then try to hit all the countries but um i've got a goal of hitting 100
[01:05] but um i've got a goal of hitting 100 countries for my daughter by the time
[01:06] countries for my daughter by the time she turns 18 and she's
[01:07] she turns 18 and she's 11 now in about about 42 countries so
[01:11] 11 now in about about 42 countries so doing okay but uh you know it might be a
[01:13] doing okay but uh you know it might be a bit of a stretch to get to 100 but we're
[01:14] bit of a stretch to get to 100 but we're trying
[01:15] trying um so you know typically uh my wife and
[01:18] um so you know typically uh my wife and i
[01:19] i uh travel with our daughter um and we
[01:21] uh travel with our daughter um and we like to travel
[01:22] like to travel in business class but we're not uh
[01:25] in business class but we're not uh we're not too good to fly economy on
[01:27] we're not too good to fly economy on occasion so typically on
[01:29] occasion so typically on uh domestic and trans border flights
[01:32] uh domestic and trans border flights we're typically flying uh
[01:34] we're typically flying uh uh on economy uh just because i can't uh
[01:36] uh on economy uh just because i can't uh i can't fathom the
[01:38] i can't fathom the the price difference as an asian uh to
[01:40] the price difference as an asian uh to pay double for
[01:41] pay double for substandard business class so um you
[01:44] substandard business class so um you know that's that's typically what we do
[01:46] know that's that's typically what we do for family travel and then for me for
[01:48] for family travel and then for me for business
[01:48] business uh you know i i do take a decent amount
[01:51] uh you know i i do take a decent amount of trips
[01:52] of trips um uh with my new job i am expecting
[01:55] um uh with my new job i am expecting that i'm going to be doing a lot more
[01:56] that i'm going to be doing a lot more travel
[01:56] travel uh as the uh coveted crisis uh
[02:00] uh as the uh coveted crisis uh uh updates but uh until then i'm kind of
[02:02] uh updates but uh until then i'm kind of stuck at home working from home
[02:04] stuck at home working from home uh and itching to travel like i'm sure
[02:06] uh and itching to travel like i'm sure many of you and your your listeners are
[02:09] many of you and your your listeners are are itching to do as well fantastic
[02:12] are itching to do as well fantastic and uh so that's three and that's one
[02:14] and uh so that's three and that's one more person that makes it
[02:16] more person that makes it easy generally from what easy points
[02:19] easy generally from what easy points travel absolutely
[02:21] travel absolutely yeah we were looking at so we're
[02:23] yeah we were looking at so we're planning on going to japan
[02:24] planning on going to japan uh in march and uh we've routed
[02:27] uh in march and uh we've routed um in japan airlines first class
[02:32] um in japan airlines first class um over to tokyo and then down to
[02:34] um over to tokyo and then down to singapore
[02:36] singapore um coming back from singapore where
[02:38] um coming back from singapore where we're flying singapore
[02:39] we're flying singapore business class but to be quite honest
[02:41] business class but to be quite honest i'm thinking of changing that because it
[02:43] i'm thinking of changing that because it doesn't look all that appealing to be
[02:45] doesn't look all that appealing to be frank and we're
[02:46] frank and we're looking at potentially using some of the
[02:49] looking at potentially using some of the alaska miles i have
[02:51] alaska miles i have and flying emirates first uh throughout
[02:54] and flying emirates first uh throughout through dubai but um yeah
[02:57] through dubai but um yeah easy to find two harder hard to find
[02:59] easy to find two harder hard to find three
[03:02] and what's not appealing about the the
[03:04] and what's not appealing about the the singapore option you're seeing is it the singapore option you're seeing is it the well you know
[03:08] well you know when i end up searching for uh reward flights i often do a lot of
[03:11] when i end up searching for uh reward flights i often do a lot of due diligence through youtube and uh
[03:12] flights i often do a lot of due diligence through youtube and uh watch a lot of youtube videos on
[03:14] due diligence through youtube and uh watch a lot of youtube videos on uh the the quality of the product and
[03:16] watch a lot of youtube videos on uh the the quality of the product and both soft and hard
[03:18] uh the the quality of the product and both soft and hard and you know to be honest uh it just
[03:20] both soft and hard and you know to be honest uh it just doesn't look that appealing um and the stories
[03:23] and you know to be honest uh it just doesn't look that appealing um and the stories i've read on the people taking
[03:23] doesn't look that appealing um and the stories i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore
[03:25] um and the stories i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um
[03:28] i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard
[03:29] uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant
[03:31] to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew
[03:34] not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on
[03:36] um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred
[03:39] and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each
[03:40] or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each um so it's it's really not that
[03:42] alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each um so it's it's really not that appealing when you consider that uh
[03:43] thousand points each um so it's it's really not that appealing when you consider that uh cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000.
[03:46] appealing when you consider that uh cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000. um so you know singapore was kind of
[03:48] cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000. um so you know singapore was kind of um we had sat in the seats when we were
[03:52] um so you know singapore was kind of um we had sat in the seats when we were out in cape town and in one of the malls out
[03:55] um we had sat in the seats when we were out in cape town and in one of the malls out there and saw that
[03:58] out in cape town and in one of the malls out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
[03:59] and in one of the malls out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
[04:01] out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
[04:03] and saw that the wide business class seat and always
[04:05] the wide business class seat and always wanted to try it but.
[04:06] wanted to try it but um now i'm having some reservations but.
[04:09] um now i'm having some reservations but i don't know if you've flown it before.
[04:10] i don't know if you've flown it before and have any opinion but i'd be.
[04:13] and have any opinion but i'd be interested to hear your opinion on that.
[04:16] interested to hear your opinion on that i've learned that in blogging if i say.
[04:18] i've learned that in blogging if i say even the slightest.
[04:20] even the slightest critical thing about singapore someone.
[04:23] critical thing about singapore someone with a singapore ip address who has.
[04:25] with a singapore ip address who has never read my blog will appear.
[04:27] never read my blog will appear and rip me to shreds i do not like the.
[04:29] and rip me to shreds i do not like the singapore airport and i hear it but i.
[04:33] singapore airport and i hear it but i feel like carpet makes me feel like it's.
[04:35] feel like carpet makes me feel like it's an offstring vegas casino rather than.
[04:37] an offstring vegas casino rather than this.
[04:38] this great international airport but i've.
[04:41] great international airport but i've i've actually.
[04:42] i've actually not flown mainline singapore i've flown.
[04:44] not flown mainline singapore i've flown silk air several times.
[04:46] silk air several times okay and use it for regional flights.
[04:49] okay and use it for regional flights uh but i mean i lived in mainland china.
[04:52] uh but i mean i lived in mainland china for a decade and.
[04:53] for a decade and singapore airlines was always more.
[04:56] singapore airlines was always more pricey cash wise.
[04:57] pricey cash wise and more out of the way than anything i.
[04:59] and more out of the way than anything i wanted so it was.
[05:01] wanted so it was really just when i when i supplemented.
[05:02] really just when i when i supplemented was was silk which still cares perfectly.
[05:04] was was silk which still cares perfectly fine it's a
[05:05] fine it's a not really a budget experience i don't know what to call it regional mid-range and that's perfectly fine but
[05:11] i've i've not been on mainline i've been curious where i live in seattle that non-stop service started last fall and i just didn't convince my wife to try it when it was easy to try it so i can't i can't help you there
[05:29] i'm curious uh i felt like years ago i loved the northwest uh business class seat which was like ultra ultra private
[05:41] and then one time i was flying and a family near me the mother was worried because she had no visibility to what her kids were doing and so for her it wasn't a good season
[05:50] and how different it is as a family and then i feel like say like virgin atlantic would probably be really fun for a kid
[05:59] so through your daughter's eyes what what product has she tried and what is she really raved about
[06:05] uh well i think her her favorite
[06:07] Uh well I think her her favorite redemption redemption um or or favorite flight that she's ever um or or favorite flight that she's ever taken was taken was having her own apartment on Etihad first having her own apartment on Etihad first class class.
[06:14] Um you know she's she's flown since um you know she's she's flown since she's been four months old and quite she's been four months old and quite extensively uh extensively uh and she's she's kind of gotten used to and she's she's kind of gotten used to the idea of the idea of um how to behave on uh especially in um how to behave on uh especially in premium premium cabin and uh so she's premium premium cabin and uh so she's very self-sufficient and and just loves the independence that uh the just loves the independence that uh the the business class seat offers uh and the business class seat offers uh and um and first class and so you know she um and first class and so you know she was was she was incredibly happy to take a she was incredibly happy to take a shower at 40 000 feet shower at 40 000 feet and kind of have a butler you know take and kind of have a butler you know take care of her care of her and you know have you know it was really and you know have you know it was really nice on Etihad.
[06:52] We had um three people in the cabin first class cabin um and and basically three crew members um and and basically three crew members uh servicing us uh uh servicing us uh the entire flight so you know she was made to feel like a princess they came and played with her and hung out with and played with her and hung out with her um and and she really loved that.
[07:07] um and and she really loved that experience um she also loved cafe first as well uh and you know she's she's had a lot of experience
[07:13] and and you know i think one of the actually one of the more more interesting experiences uh was on westjet uh when we had to fly out to london ontario uh from calgary and uh
[07:25] she made friends with the faa and uh helped uh uh with a uh garbage pickup uh in in service and uh so she wore the the westjet scarf and everything and then told me she wanted to be a flight attendant
[07:40] this was when she was very young and then um westjet was nice enough to actually put a note on our reservation on the return and uh bumped us up into the north american business class which was nice so
[07:52] um i think she she's always had a soft spark in her heart for westjet as well really and i was going to jump in and say because i know you you worked for westjet for a period that if if she's developed these tastes then she probably doesn't want what daddy's employee travels
[08:08] employee travels yeah you know like i said we don't mind
[08:10] yeah you know like i said we don't mind so much flying economy
[08:12] so much flying economy in north america because you know
[08:13] in north america because you know typically the longest flight you'll see
[08:15] typically the longest flight you'll see from calgary is you know
[08:18] from calgary is you know six seven eight hours so it's it's it's
[08:21] six seven eight hours so it's it's it's it's passable it's it's not the greatest
[08:23] it's passable it's it's not the greatest obviously but
[08:24] obviously but um you know we've flown overnight direct
[08:26] um you know we've flown overnight direct from calgary to halifax uh and that was
[08:29] from calgary to halifax uh and that was that was fine and she's small enough
[08:31] that was fine and she's small enough that uh she doesn't really care as long
[08:33] that uh she doesn't really care as long as she kind of gets to see something new
[08:35] as she kind of gets to see something new so um yeah she she doesn't mind flying
[08:37] so um yeah she she doesn't mind flying west yet and we still do a decent amount
[08:39] west yet and we still do a decent amount of domestic
[08:40] of domestic travel on westjet but uh i think that if
[08:42] travel on westjet but uh i think that if you asked or she would probably prefer
[08:44] you asked or she would probably prefer uh being in premium cabin for sure well
[08:47] uh being in premium cabin for sure well that's the union you brought up westjet
[08:49] that's the union you brought up westjet let's talk westjet i
[08:50] let's talk westjet i think it's not on the radar for a lot of
[08:54] think it's not on the radar for a lot of non-canadian travelers i i became aware
[08:57] non-canadian travelers i i became aware when i lived in new york
[08:58] when i lived in new york and delta developed a partnership with
[09:00] and delta developed a partnership with them where i
[09:01] them where i showed up for my flight in laguardia at
[09:03] showed up for my flight in laguardia at the toronto and it
[09:05] the toronto and it the gate agents were being staffed by
[09:07] the gate agents were being staffed by like kids and t-shirts and jeans
[09:11] where's my delta flight and then but i
[09:14] where's my delta flight and then but i got on board i mean
[09:15] got on board i mean it's a very uh straightforward
[09:17] it's a very uh straightforward experience but i love the little uh
[09:19] experience but i love the little uh lemon zest packets that come with the
[09:21] lemon zest packets that come with the flight and then
[09:23] flight and then quick flight over and that's that's what
[09:25] quick flight over and that's that's what i knew for a few years
[09:26] i knew for a few years yeah yeah i mean i i worked at westjet
[09:30] yeah yeah i mean i i worked at westjet um
[09:31] um in the loyalty department um as
[09:33] in the loyalty department um as ultimately as the senior
[09:35] ultimately as the senior the interim senior manager for loyalty
[09:37] the interim senior manager for loyalty uh for a period where i ran a team of
[09:40] uh for a period where i ran a team of six individuals of analysts and
[09:42] six individuals of analysts and marketers
[09:44] marketers that were concentrated on the loyalty
[09:46] that were concentrated on the loyalty program and
[09:47] program and trying to extract as much value uh from
[09:50] trying to extract as much value uh from our
[09:51] our our top tier members as possible and so
[09:53] that meant promotions and
[09:54] that meant promotions and and really understanding the deep
[09:57] and really understanding the deep analytics of uh how people behave
[09:59] analytics of uh how people behave in um as as top tier members of a
[10:02] in um as as top tier members of a loyalty program
[10:03] loyalty program and trying to really understand how it
[10:07] and trying to really understand how it is or
[10:07] is or you know what what keeps people flying
[10:09] you know what what keeps people flying uh what do they value
[10:11] uh what do they value those kinds of things obviously every
[10:13] those kinds of things obviously every individual's unique but
[10:15] individual's unique but generally you have kind of a general
[10:17] generally you have kind of a general bucket of what people
[10:19] bucket of what people really value uh and and it was really
[10:21] really value uh and and it was really interesting kind of getting that insight
[10:24] interesting kind of getting that insight um and then also being able to to speak
[10:26] um and then also being able to to speak uh individually with some of our top
[10:28] uh individually with some of our top tier members
[10:29] tier members um and and really validating the what we
[10:31] um and and really validating the what we were
[10:32] were extracting from the the data we were
[10:34] extracting from the the data we were seeing
[10:36] seeing oh wow so with the the peak behind the
[10:38] oh wow so with the the peak behind the curtain and
[10:39] curtain and frequent flyers often feel like these
[10:42] frequent flyers often feel like these programs are staffed by people that just
[10:45] programs are staffed by people that just don't get them right or or deliberate
[10:47] don't get them right or or deliberate deliberately or not
[10:48] deliberately or not but you're you're one of us in the sense
[10:53] but you're you're one of us in the sense this interest in travel uh
[10:56] this interest in travel uh and pr perhaps some of your colleagues
[10:58] and pr perhaps some of your colleagues didn't come from they might have come
[10:59] didn't come from they might have come from
[11:00] from say a finance or a marketing background
[11:03] say a finance or a marketing background from a different industry what
[11:05] from a different industry what what did you how did you communicate
[11:08] what did you how did you communicate what it's like
[11:09] what it's like i don't know if you consider yourself an
[11:10] i don't know if you consider yourself an av geek but uh you know
[11:12] av geek but uh you know that that love for flying how did you
[11:14] that that love for flying how did you communicate that
[11:15] communicate that to colleagues who are just just going to
[11:17] to colleagues who are just just going to another corporate job
[11:18] another corporate job well i think um in general people that
[11:21] well i think um in general people that work for airlines
[11:22] work for airlines tend to be uh uh have geeks as well um
[11:25] tend to be uh uh have geeks as well um you know when
[11:26] you know when when we launched the 787 um
[11:29] when we launched the 787 um you you you needed to pay our cleaners a
[11:32] you you you needed to pay our cleaners a lot of extra money to clear all the
[11:34] lot of extra money to clear all the face smudges off the windows as people
[11:35] face smudges off the windows as people were watching the the plane wall off the
[11:38] were watching the the plane wall off the roll on the tarmac for the first time um
[11:40] roll on the tarmac for the first time um and so
[11:41] and so you know i i think in general everyone
[11:43] you know i i think in general everyone that worked at westjet
[11:45] that worked at westjet uh broad brush obviously but i think
[11:47] uh broad brush obviously but i think everyone was a big fan of of
[11:49] everyone was a big fan of of airlines and uh aircraft um but you know
[11:53] airlines and uh aircraft um but you know back to your kind of question around
[11:57] back to your kind of question around you know how how how do we kind of
[12:00] you know how how how do we kind of convey some of the passion that we have
[12:02] convey some of the passion that we have as loyalty
[12:03] as loyalty enthusiasts in a loyalty program and do
[12:06] enthusiasts in a loyalty program and do the people that work in that program
[12:09] the people that work in that program have the same kind of background and you
[12:11] have the same kind of background and you know to be quite frank
[12:13] know to be quite frank unfortunately the answer is not a real
[12:15] unfortunately the answer is not a real positive one in that
[12:16] positive one in that a lot of those folks tended to come from
[12:19] a lot of those folks tended to come from different parts of westjet and were kind
[12:21] different parts of westjet and were kind of
[12:22] of you know new to loyalty i mean they they
[12:24] you know new to loyalty i mean they they had when i
[12:25] had when i when i left there were um i think there
[12:28] when i left there were um i think there was just
[12:29] was just there were two people um that i'm aware
[12:31] there were two people um that i'm aware of that they brought in
[12:33] of that they brought in um that had some background in loyalty
[12:35] um that had some background in loyalty one worked for avios
[12:37] one worked for avios uh the other one who was the director of
[12:38] uh the other one who was the director of the group um
[12:40] the group um had worked for uh emirates um so he had
[12:42] had worked for uh emirates um so he had some background
[12:43] some background uh he also worked for collison so
[12:45] uh he also worked for collison so understood the lounge side of things
[12:47] understood the lounge side of things so it was really interesting talking to
[12:49] so it was really interesting talking to them and getting their perspective on
[12:50] them and getting their perspective on things
[12:51] things but other people within the group they
[12:54] but other people within the group they tended to come from other aspects
[12:56] tended to come from other aspects and the vp who ran the the group
[12:59] and the vp who ran the the group uh actually came from supply chain and
[13:02] uh actually came from supply chain and so
[13:03] so there was kind of um a bit of a
[13:06] there was kind of um a bit of a challenge
[13:06] challenge in having people understand the value of
[13:08] in having people understand the value of loyalty and and some of the
[13:10] loyalty and and some of the uh things that we were trying to do
[13:12] uh things that we were trying to do often were difficult
[13:14] Often were difficult because not only did we need to convince other departments within WestJet that our ideas were valid and would provide value, but it was also, you know, that we had to take that first step of explaining it and having people within the group of loyalty understand it as well.
[13:30] So, you know, if you have to kind of explain that there's always going to be some sort of uh information lost in translation.
[13:38] So as they, you know, tried to sell our ideas upwards, they didn't have the same level of understanding or potentially passion of what we were trying to accomplish.
[13:49] So it often, I often found it very frustrating trying to get things done.
[13:53] Um, you know, somebody, I was actually in charge of the frequent flyer programs, uh, uh, of the redemption partners, as well as our own loyalty program, uh, which is called Member Exclusive, which is the, uh, the award inventory for WestJet.
[14:11] And there were a few interesting things I was trying to do.
[14:15] was trying to do um but we were often at odds with revenue
[14:18] but we were often at odds with revenue management
[14:19] management uh whose purpose at the airline is to
[14:22] uh whose purpose at the airline is to make money
[14:23] make money uh and as you can imagine uh when i was
[14:26] uh and as you can imagine uh when i was there westjet was a publicly traded
[14:27] there westjet was a publicly traded company
[14:28] company and so these guys were always interested
[14:31] and so these guys were always interested in
[14:32] in how their their quarterly results looked
[14:34] how their their quarterly results looked uh so to get
[14:35] uh so to get attention from them to try to
[14:39] attention from them to try to put forward and develop a long term
[14:43] put forward and develop a long term idea that would take some time to
[14:45] idea that would take some time to implement and return value on
[14:47] implement and return value on was often a very difficult challenge
[14:52] yeah and when i'm i don't know how much
[14:53] yeah and when i'm i don't know how much the program
[14:55] the program looks like it did when you were there
[14:58] looks like it did when you were there uh but when i when i'm glancing at the
[15:01] uh but when i when i'm glancing at the current benefits what what jumps out to
[15:02] current benefits what what jumps out to me more familiar with uh some of the us
[15:05] programs is you've got gold which
[15:09] six times a year gets advanced seat selection
[15:11] selection but yet gets unlimited lounge access for
[15:12] but yet gets unlimited lounge access for the traveler and immediate family and
[15:16] the traveler and immediate family and guest vouchers.
[15:17] Guest vouchers yeah which it it seems to me a US program is absolutely reversed where.
[15:21] program is absolutely reversed where they'll hand out all kinds of seat selection.
[15:25] selection but then lounge access is incredibly hard to come by and I'm curious.
[15:30] hard to come by and I'm curious where where that leads I don't even I guess I don't know the WestJet lounge experience to be honest I've used some of the third-party lounges on Priority Pass when flying WestJet.
[15:38] Yeah so WestJet um doesn't have currently any of its own lounges uh they're all third-party uh and and largely the same lounges that you're experiencing through Priority Pass.
[15:50] However uh the flagship lounge out of Calgary uh is being built uh I don't have a timeline as to when it's supposed to be opening but I believe it's supposed to be later on towards the end of this year.
[15:56] opening but I believe it's supposed to be later on towards the end of this year I think October was the last I'd heard um the flagship lounge actually is it's a very interesting value proposition there.
[16:04] um the flagship lounge actually is it's a very interesting value proposition there um the West side has worked very closely with the Calgary Airport Authority um being that it's based out of Calgary so they have very strong relationships um and the airport authority went so far.
[16:18] um and the airport authority went so far as to help move the main security checkpoint.
[16:22] help move the main security checkpoint um from uh a different gate to a gate that's right in front of this new lounge.
[16:27] that's right in front of this new lounge um to kind of have that uh um view of envy if you couldn't get in when you when you went through security.
[16:35] uh and so that's that's slated to be open later but what's interesting is that um the head of digital his name is alfredo tan actually came from facebook.
[16:44] and he had a lot of contacts within silicon valley and they had what they they called their first ever hackathon um for the westjet lounge and they brought in uh companies like salesforce ibm apple um all facebook all these big companies um to basically have a case competition to come up with ideas on how to uh develop a lounge largely technology based.
[17:10] based and i don't have all the details of what what they ended up with because budget was always a concern but they were looking at very interesting things like you know if
[17:19] very interesting things like you know if a plane took off
[17:20] a plane took off uh and you could see it uh through the
[17:22] uh and you could see it uh through the the window uh yeah one of the ideas was
[17:24] the window uh yeah one of the ideas was to have
[17:25] to have kind of a marker track uh where that
[17:27] kind of a marker track uh where that plane was going to and
[17:28] plane was going to and cares about the flight things like that
[17:30] cares about the flight things like that very interactive
[17:32] very interactive uh but you know with with all the the
[17:34] uh but you know with with all the the changes of what's happened with covid i
[17:36] changes of what's happened with covid i have no idea what's actually going to be
[17:37] have no idea what's actually going to be in that lounge
[17:38] in that lounge um but you know in terms of
[17:42] um but you know in terms of why did they do the unlimited lounge
[17:45] why did they do the unlimited lounge i alluded to the fact that um you know
[17:48] i alluded to the fact that um you know learning what what is a value to our top
[17:51] learning what what is a value to our top tier members
[17:52] tier members uh was that you know they they travel
[17:54] uh was that you know they they travel plenty
[17:55] plenty for for work and a lot of times you know
[17:58] for for work and a lot of times you know they get all these the ancillaries paid
[18:00] they get all these the ancillaries paid for by their their work so you know they
[18:02] for by their their work so you know they see selection they get free bag all that
[18:04] see selection they get free bag all that stuff is is
[18:05] stuff is is just it's it's nothing to them right so
[18:08] just it's it's nothing to them right so what really matters to them um and i
[18:10] what really matters to them um and i think you probably hear this
[18:11] think you probably hear this many times is that as a road warrior
[18:14] many times is that as a road warrior because you're away from
[18:15] because you're away from from home for so long that when you
[18:17] from home for so long that when you actually take a family vacation
[18:19] actually take a family vacation uh you want to show off to your family
[18:21] uh you want to show off to your family that hey look this is what
[18:23] that hey look this is what you know me being away gets us as a
[18:25] you know me being away gets us as a family while we travel
[18:26] family while we travel which is why they're allowing unlimited
[18:30] which is why they're allowing unlimited access to lounges
[18:31] access to lounges for the member as well as family members
[18:33] for the member as well as family members so that that is kind of a unique
[18:35] so that that is kind of a unique offering that you don't see very often
[18:37] offering that you don't see very often in lounges and
[18:38] in lounges and and you could have a very large family
[18:40] and you could have a very large family group i think it's up to eight people
[18:42] group i think it's up to eight people um family so you know that's that's
[18:45] um family so you know that's that's always nice you know as
[18:46] always nice you know as as a traveler when i travel with my wife
[18:48] as a traveler when i travel with my wife and daughter it nothing irks me more
[18:51] and daughter it nothing irks me more than
[18:51] than um going into a lounge uh like a
[18:53] um going into a lounge uh like a priority pass lounge where
[18:55] priority pass lounge where you know i've got two access for two but
[18:57] you know i've got two access for two but my daughter who you know barely eats
[18:59] my daughter who you know barely eats just needs to be with us
[19:00] just needs to be with us gets turned 27 us dollars right that
[19:03] gets turned 27 us dollars right that that just irks me a lot
[19:05] that just irks me a lot so you know i can imagine that you know
[19:06] so you know i can imagine that you know as a frequent flyer
[19:08] as a frequent flyer if you're traveling for for vacation on
[19:10] if you're traveling for for vacation on your with your family and
[19:11] your with your family and being told at the door that you could
[19:13] being told at the door that you could only get one other person in
[19:15] only get one other person in um that could be quite bothersome um
[19:18] um that could be quite bothersome um you know financially it's an interesting
[19:21] you know financially it's an interesting um
[19:21] um interesting approach because it can be interesting approach because it can be quite expensive to have people in lounge so uh yeah it'll be it'll be interesting to see if they pair back that benefit or not
[19:32] yeah and flagship lounge when i hear words like that it doesn't sound like they're trying to be a a uh a budget airline it sounds like they're they're they're ramping up and going after air canada well yeah that's that's the intent
[19:44] um now i guess the the challenge is that uh you know air canada is the incumbent um and they they really understand their top tier members um and and uh you know the lounges have been uh really good for a long time uh and the advent of their signature series lounges uh in vancouver and toronto uh make it even that much more attractive to be an air canada top tier member
[20:09] um but when i when i moved over to westjet one of the reasons i did so was uh the launch of the 787 and the idea that they were actually going uh to put a business class that was comparable to air canada and in some respects even better excuse
[20:23] and in some respects even better excuse me um
[20:24] me um the the person who actually uh designed
[20:27] the the person who actually uh designed the
[20:27] the uh westjet pods uh
[20:30] uh westjet pods uh was the same guy who did the q suites
[20:32] was the same guy who did the q suites for cutter and
[20:34] for cutter and he's since moved on to air italy but
[20:37] he's since moved on to air italy but you know it was almost like budget
[20:40] you know it was almost like budget wasn't
[20:40] wasn't much of a concern when they decided to
[20:42] much of a concern when they decided to develop business class because they
[20:43] develop business class because they really wanted to go after the business
[20:45] really wanted to go after the business traveler
[20:46] traveler and so all of that included uh you know
[20:50] and so all of that included uh you know things that we talked about earlier
[20:51] things that we talked about earlier which is
[20:52] which is uh both the hard product and the soft
[20:54] uh both the hard product and the soft product so um you know when we
[20:55] product so um you know when we when i toured the 787 the first time i
[20:58] when i toured the 787 the first time i was pretty impressed
[20:59] was pretty impressed you know they had some very nuanced
[21:01] you know they had some very nuanced touches um
[21:02] touches um that that are quite unique uh as a
[21:04] that that are quite unique uh as a canadian airline for example
[21:06] canadian airline for example you know if you're flying to europe and
[21:08] you know if you're flying to europe and you're you're doing a red-eye
[21:10] you're you're doing a red-eye as you're starting to land uh you hear
[21:12] as you're starting to land uh you hear the the call of the loon
[21:13] the the call of the loon uh famous canadian bird as your wake-up
[21:16] uh famous canadian bird as your wake-up call as the lights start coming up
[21:18] call as the lights start coming up uh and so just you know just very small
[21:21] uh and so just you know just very small touches like that
[21:22] touches like that um the food is actually excellent uh
[21:24] um the food is actually excellent uh some of the better food i've had on uh
[21:27] some of the better food i've had on uh in a domestic uh business class and
[21:30] in a domestic uh business class and they had flown that flight uh from
[21:33] they had flown that flight uh from calgary to toronto as they were getting
[21:34] calgary to toronto as they were getting their certification
[21:35] their certification uh and so i flew it i think three times
[21:38] uh and so i flew it i think three times in business class and it was it was
[21:40] in business class and it was it was excellent
[21:40] excellent very great service um but uh yeah they
[21:44] very great service um but uh yeah they were definitely going after the air
[21:45] were definitely going after the air canada
[21:46] canada uh top tier members um but it it was
[21:49] uh top tier members um but it it was definitely a challenge because uh you
[21:51] definitely a challenge because uh you know as as you know
[21:52] know as as you know once you become uh you know a million
[21:55] once you become uh you know a million miler or a diamond member or a 100k
[21:59] miler or a diamond member or a 100k super elite it it comes very difficult
[22:02] super elite it it comes very difficult to pry those people away and
[22:03] to pry those people away and but that that is the intent was to try
[22:06] but that that is the intent was to try to secure some of those um
[22:08] to secure some of those um big margin people uh to come over to
[22:10] big margin people uh to come over to westjet and
[22:11] westjet and you know they were making changes to um
[22:14] you know they were making changes to um the the hard products uh on both the 787
[22:18] the the hard products uh on both the 787 which was brand new
[22:19] which was brand new as well as retrofitting all the 737s
[22:22] as well as retrofitting all the 737s that they've got
[22:23] that they've got to a true business class uh so uh or
[22:26] to a true business class uh so uh or domestic business class which was two by
[22:28] domestic business class which was two by two
[22:28] two uh previously uh they were three by
[22:31] uh previously uh they were three by three with a blocked middle
[22:32] three with a blocked middle so european business class and to be
[22:35] so european business class and to be frank it was nothing special so
[22:37] frank it was nothing special so uh they were really um upping their game
[22:40] uh they were really um upping their game and spending a little bit
[22:41] and spending a little bit of money to try to get that uh going um
[22:44] of money to try to get that uh going um but like i said air canada has had that
[22:46] but like i said air canada has had that that product for a very long time um
[22:49] that product for a very long time um you know it'll be interesting to see if
[22:51] you know it'll be interesting to see if they can pry away some of those top tier
[22:52] they can pry away some of those top tier members
[22:54] members seems like calgary as a base makes a lot
[22:57] seems like calgary as a base makes a lot of sense both
[22:58] of sense both geography and industry wise
[23:01] geography and industry wise yeah yeah um interestingly you know when
[23:04] yeah yeah um interestingly you know when we
[23:05] we launched the 787 um we
[23:08] launched the 787 um we we partnered well the jv with delta i
[23:11] we partnered well the jv with delta i think is finalized now but i'm not 100
[23:13] think is finalized now but i'm not 100 sure but
[23:14] sure but one of the reasons the the jv was put in
[23:16] one of the reasons the the jv was put in place
[23:17] place um was the idea that uh delta has a a
[23:21] um was the idea that uh delta has a a pretty strong network on the west coast
[23:24] pretty strong network on the west coast uh and the idea was that it would uh it
[23:26] uh and the idea was that it would uh it would filter or bring people to calgary
[23:28] would filter or bring people to calgary as a international hub
[23:30] as a international hub and as the 787 started establishing
[23:32] and as the 787 started establishing international routes
[23:34] international routes um you know they fly to london paris uh
[23:36] um you know they fly to london paris uh dublin
[23:37] dublin and uh barcelona now i believe um and
[23:40] and uh barcelona now i believe um and now rome i think
[23:42] now rome i think and uh uh as they expand the idea was to
[23:45] and uh uh as they expand the idea was to take some of that international travel
[23:47] take some of that international travel with the weaker canadian dollar and
[23:50] with the weaker canadian dollar and a pretty strong uh product uh to be able
[23:52] a pretty strong uh product uh to be able to fly americans
[23:54] to fly americans uh with a stop over in calgary and then
[23:56] uh with a stop over in calgary and then fly over to
[23:57] fly over to europe or potentially asia in the future
[24:01] europe or potentially asia in the future i'll be all for it delta flyer uh award
[24:03] i'll be all for it delta flyer uh award pricing is so problematic for delta with
[24:06] pricing is so problematic for delta with all of its partners including westjet
[24:07] all of its partners including westjet that it's
[24:08] that it's often additive it's whatever the westjet
[24:10] often additive it's whatever the westjet flight would cost
[24:12] flight would cost plus delta adding you know the bazillion
[24:14] plus delta adding you know the bazillion that miles
[24:16] that miles they might do and then it it seems to
[24:17] they might do and then it it seems to have a magnifying effect when you
[24:19] have a magnifying effect when you you know the alchemy of the two together
[24:22] you know the alchemy of the two together so i remember
[24:22] so i remember i've never redeemed a delta award on
[24:26] i've never redeemed a delta award on westjet
[24:26] westjet it's because of that yeah they're paid
[24:28] it's because of that yeah they're paid cash yeah
[24:30] cash yeah um asking oh hersty had a great
[24:32] um asking oh hersty had a great experience flying to saint martin where
[24:35] experience flying to saint martin where his westjet flight was delayed and they
[24:37] his westjet flight was delayed and they uh compensated him for
[24:39] uh compensated him for missing his uh flight onward flight to
[24:41] missing his uh flight onward flight to seba which was on an entirely different
[24:42] seba which was on an entirely different airline so he's
[24:44] airline so he's he's well disposed to westjet but he's
[24:46] he's well disposed to westjet but he's asking what do you think of westjet
[24:48] asking what do you think of westjet dollars
[24:48] dollars so this is the rewards currency instead
[24:50] so this is the rewards currency instead of what uh
[24:51] of what uh some might call miles so i i have a very
[24:55] some might call miles so i i have a very interesting relationship with westjet
[24:57] interesting relationship with westjet dollars um
[24:58] dollars um i really dislike them um and and the
[25:01] i really dislike them um and and the reason
[25:02] reason is that you know as a westjetter i saw
[25:05] is that you know as a westjetter i saw that the westjet dollar
[25:07] that the westjet dollar was something that really held westjet
[25:10] was something that really held westjet back
[25:10] back um in terms of being able to generate
[25:12] um in terms of being able to generate revenue and
[25:13] revenue and stefan i'm sure that you can appreciate
[25:15] stefan i'm sure that you can appreciate that airlines generate a ton of revenue
[25:18] that airlines generate a ton of revenue through their currencies
[25:20] through their currencies it was very very difficult to
[25:23] it was very very difficult to really make any sort of money on by
[25:26] really make any sort of money on by selling westjet dollars
[25:27] selling westjet dollars simply because um one one westjet dollar
[25:30] simply because um one one westjet dollar was equivalent of one canadian dollar
[25:33] was equivalent of one canadian dollar um so it's not like you could buy uh you
[25:35] um so it's not like you could buy uh you know
[25:36] know um i don't know a pack of gum and get
[25:38] um i don't know a pack of gum and get you know uh a one west you have dollar
[25:40] you know uh a one west you have dollar for it right that would be ridiculous
[25:43] for it right that would be ridiculous is that they don't they don't have
[25:44] is that they don't they don't have fractional west yet dollars so you
[25:46] fractional west yet dollars so you couldn't earn like
[25:47] couldn't earn like uh three westjet cents or something like
[25:49] uh three westjet cents or something like that on a pack of gum
[25:50] that on a pack of gum and even if you could right um how
[25:53] and even if you could right um how how how rewarding is it to to earn three
[25:56] how how rewarding is it to to earn three westjet cents on a pack of gum like it
[25:58] westjet cents on a pack of gum like it just
[25:59] just you would you'd think like this is going
[26:00] you would you'd think like this is going to take forever to get anywhere
[26:02] to take forever to get anywhere uh the other problem it's like a slim
[26:05] uh the other problem it's like a slim forms episode where they're going to
[26:06] forms episode where they're going to crusty land and
[26:08] crusty land and trade my money for these fun dollars
[26:10] trade my money for these fun dollars yeah exactly
[26:12] yeah exactly develop because they're fun
[26:15] i mean the other problem is that westjet
[26:18] i mean the other problem is that westjet has done itself
[26:19] has done itself quite a disservice in that westjet
[26:21] quite a disservice in that westjet dollars
[26:22] dollars for canadians they're largely known as
[26:24] for canadians they're largely known as basically an offset on a regular price
[26:26] basically an offset on a regular price ticket
[26:28] ticket so i mentioned member exclusive which is
[26:29] so i mentioned member exclusive which is the distressed inventory of westjet
[26:32] the distressed inventory of westjet and again they've done themselves a huge
[26:34] and again they've done themselves a huge disservice
[26:35] disservice rate currently member exclusive fares
[26:38] rate currently member exclusive fares are no longer available
[26:39] are no longer available on westjet because they're quote
[26:42] on westjet because they're quote uh updating the system i don't know what
[26:44] uh updating the system i don't know what they're actually doing they have been
[26:45] they're actually doing they have been very secretive about it
[26:48] very secretive about it but even if it was in place people
[26:51] but even if it was in place people didn't really understand
[26:52] didn't really understand what what member exclusive fares were so
[26:55] what what member exclusive fares were so very poor marketing there um you know i
[26:58] very poor marketing there um you know i i knew about it obviously because i ran
[26:59] i knew about it obviously because i ran the program but
[27:00] the program but um you know for it it can be quite
[27:03] um you know for it it can be quite lucrative right so you can fly
[27:05] lucrative right so you can fly transcon from vancouver to new york
[27:08] transcon from vancouver to new york anywhere from
[27:09] anywhere from in canada and the us for 125 westjet
[27:12] in canada and the us for 125 westjet dollars one way plus tax so
[27:14] dollars one way plus tax so roughly about i think it's about 40
[27:16] roughly about i think it's about 40 canadian um for taxes if you're coming
[27:18] canadian um for taxes if you're coming out of a canadian airport because of the
[27:20] out of a canadian airport because of the airport taxes
[27:21] airport taxes but essentially for you know 160 170
[27:24] but essentially for you know 160 170 dollars
[27:26] dollars that you can fly transcon and the award
[27:29] that you can fly transcon and the award availability was insane it was it was
[27:31] availability was insane it was it was quite
[27:31] quite quite generous but people didn't know
[27:33] quite generous but people didn't know about it and what other
[27:35] about it and what other another thing that people didn't know is
[27:36] another thing that people didn't know is that um westjet dollars
[27:38] that um westjet dollars uh the idea was that you had to earn
[27:40] uh the idea was that you had to earn them through the credit card
[27:42] them through the credit card or flying on westjet but because of the
[27:44] or flying on westjet but because of the points partnership with
[27:45] points partnership with points.com you would actually go through
[27:48] points.com you would actually go through the flow and
[27:49] the flow and search for a member exclusive fare uh
[27:51] search for a member exclusive fare uh the idea was that you had to have 100 of
[27:53] the idea was that you had to have 100 of the westjet dollars in your account
[27:54] the westjet dollars in your account in order to redeem um but as part of the
[27:57] in order to redeem um but as part of the flow
[27:58] flow as you walk through the process if the
[28:00] as you walk through the process if the system detected you didn't have enough
[28:01] system detected you didn't have enough westjet dollars they would just redirect
[28:03] westjet dollars they would just redirect you to points.com where you could buy
[28:05] you to points.com where you could buy the westjet dollars
[28:06] the westjet dollars almost on par um you could buy uh
[28:10] almost on par um you could buy uh 3 000 westjet dollars for something like
[28:14] 3 000 westjet dollars for something like a hundred and fifty dollars in uh fees
[28:18] a hundred and fifty dollars in uh fees uh which is insane
[28:21] uh which is insane and so canadian company right they don't
[28:24] and so canadian company right they don't have an excuse for
[28:25] have an excuse for yeah misunderstanding about how this
[28:28] yeah misunderstanding about how this should work
[28:29] should work yeah so so i hated it for that reason in
[28:32] yeah so so i hated it for that reason in that
[28:32] that um it wasn't an engaging points program
[28:34] um it wasn't an engaging points program um but the other thing i really disliked
[28:36] um but the other thing i really disliked about it was that um you couldn't
[28:38] about it was that um you couldn't sell those points to retailers because
[28:40] sell those points to retailers because it was just too
[28:41] it was just too too expensive i mean right now um the
[28:44] too expensive i mean right now um the biggest
[28:45] biggest purchaser of westjet dollars is rbc the
[28:47] purchaser of westjet dollars is rbc the the financial institute
[28:49] the financial institute partner and you know the in order to
[28:52] partner and you know the in order to earn one westjet dollar you actually
[28:53] earn one westjet dollar you actually have to spend about 66.66
[28:56] have to spend about 66.66 in order to earn one less jet dollar um
[28:59] in order to earn one less jet dollar um and so you can imagine uh if if you're a
[29:02] and so you can imagine uh if if you're a retailer and you're telling your people
[29:04] retailer and you're telling your people um that your customers that you have to
[29:05] um that your customers that you have to spend almost 70 earn one less jet dollar
[29:09] spend almost 70 earn one less jet dollar i mean it's not a very exciting value
[29:11] i mean it's not a very exciting value proposition
[29:12] proposition um and again even if you did spend
[29:14] um and again even if you did spend seventy dollars at a retailer and you
[29:16] seventy dollars at a retailer and you got one westjet dollar it's like
[29:18] got one westjet dollar it's like what am i going to do with one less jet
[29:19] what am i going to do with one less jet dollar offset the the price of a ticket
[29:22] dollar offset the the price of a ticket by a dollar like what
[29:23] by a dollar like what why would i collect that currency and so
[29:26] why would i collect that currency and so it becomes um
[29:27] it becomes um an issue that you can't sell that
[29:28] an issue that you can't sell that currency and therefore you can't
[29:30] currency and therefore you can't raise uh revenue for the airline and
[29:33] raise uh revenue for the airline and therefore you can't use that revenue to
[29:35] therefore you can't use that revenue to improve the program so
[29:36] improve the program so um you know westjet is caught in a
[29:39] um you know westjet is caught in a vicious cycle
[29:40] vicious cycle whereas um you know aeroplan who's just
[29:43] whereas um you know aeroplan who's just launched a new program
[29:45] launched a new program uh is caught in what i believe is a
[29:47] uh is caught in what i believe is a virtuous cycle so they have a very
[29:48] virtuous cycle so they have a very manageable currency program they've got
[29:51] manageable currency program they've got excellent
[29:52] excellent flight availability a great network and
[29:54] flight availability a great network and now with no yq in their program
[29:57] now with no yq in their program people are going to want to fly the
[29:58] people are going to want to fly the program and then as people start
[30:00] program and then as people start collecting points they're going to
[30:01] collecting points they're going to demand from the retailers that they want
[30:03] demand from the retailers that they want to be able to collect points
[30:04] to be able to collect points and then as they demand that retailers
[30:06] and then as they demand that retailers need to start buying points from
[30:08] need to start buying points from air canada and and as people are as
[30:10] air canada and and as people are as retailers start buying points then
[30:11] retailers start buying points then there's more money to invest back into
[30:13] there's more money to invest back into the program get more
[30:14] the program get more uh flight reward availability within air
[30:16] uh flight reward availability within air canada and negotiate better pro
[30:18] canada and negotiate better pro or better access to reward inventory
[30:21] or better access to reward inventory with partners you know all these things
[30:23] with partners you know all these things um they're going in the right direction
[30:25] um they're going in the right direction whereas westjet i believe is going the
[30:26] whereas westjet i believe is going the opposite
[30:27] opposite wrong direction yeah it was uh
[30:31] wrong direction yeah it was uh a taste of the danforth in toronto five
[30:33] a taste of the danforth in toronto five years ago and i
[30:35] years ago and i i did a joking blog post about how bad
[30:37] i did a joking blog post about how bad the card bonuses are because there was a
[30:39] the card bonuses are because there was a card uh
[30:41] card uh it was a toronto fc air miles card you
[30:43] it was a toronto fc air miles card you get 400 mile
[30:45] get 400 mile bonus and then i got lectured of how
[30:49] bonus and then i got lectured of how it's actually
[30:50] it's actually worth something but i mean related to
[30:52] worth something but i mean related to i'm looking at westjet
[30:53] i'm looking at westjet rewards tears and benefits which i
[30:56] rewards tears and benefits which i i live and breed loyalty programs as a
[30:59] i live and breed loyalty programs as a hobby i
[31:00] hobby i i can understand most i've encountered
[31:02] i can understand most i've encountered except the new united program
[31:04] except the new united program but i i cannot for the life of me figure
[31:07] but i i cannot for the life of me figure out
[31:08] out it says the tier is on 100
[31:11] it says the tier is on 100 of westjet marketed flights flown but
[31:14] of westjet marketed flights flown but then it says earn westjet dollars at
[31:16] then it says earn westjet dollars at these rates
[31:17] these rates teal 0.5 percent silver 3
[31:21] teal 0.5 percent silver 3 gold 5 percent platinum 8 for flying
[31:23] gold 5 percent platinum 8 for flying westjet flights that
[31:25] westjet flights that that means absolutely nothing to me i
[31:27] that means absolutely nothing to me i don't know eight percent of of what and
[31:29] don't know eight percent of of what and how that
[31:33] how that it's complicated and unless you're
[31:34] it's complicated and unless you're really um willing to invest
[31:37] really um willing to invest and understand what the program is you
[31:38] and understand what the program is you you at a glance you would have no idea
[31:40] you at a glance you would have no idea what that means
[31:41] what that means um what it actually means is that as a
[31:43] um what it actually means is that as a platinum you would
[31:44] platinum you would earn eight percent of your base uh fair
[31:48] earn eight percent of your base uh fair spend
[31:48] spend uh back in westjet dollars uh and so
[31:52] uh back in westjet dollars uh and so uh you know if you if you have the
[31:54] uh you know if you if you have the westjet credit card it gives you another
[31:55] westjet credit card it gives you another two percent so
[31:56] two percent so in actuality as a platinum member
[31:58] in actuality as a platinum member holding the credit card
[32:00] holding the credit card and putting flights on the credit card
[32:01] and putting flights on the credit card you're earning 10 back which is actually
[32:03] you're earning 10 back which is actually incredibly
[32:05] incredibly generous um but you know
[32:08] generous um but you know going back to the idea that uh the
[32:10] going back to the idea that uh the person who runs the program is in supply
[32:12] person who runs the program is in supply chain
[32:13] chain uh and um has to answer for financial
[32:17] uh and um has to answer for financial [Music]
[32:19] [Music] results uh you you you don't know the
[32:21] results uh you you you don't know the program but
[32:22] program but um the way they got to eight percent
[32:24] um the way they got to eight percent with the platinum
[32:26] with the platinum is that they took away half a percent
[32:28] is that they took away half a percent from the teals
[32:29] from the teals uh so as you can imagine um as
[32:32] uh so as you can imagine um as as someone who's looking to join a new
[32:34] as someone who's looking to join a new program as a new flyer imagine you're a
[32:36] program as a new flyer imagine you're a new executive and you're gonna fly a lot
[32:38] new executive and you're gonna fly a lot and you have a choice of air canada or
[32:40] and you have a choice of air canada or westjet
[32:42] westjet well number one you have to start as a
[32:44] well number one you have to start as a teal so how attractive is earning
[32:46] teal so how attractive is earning point five percent or sorry point five
[32:49] point five percent or sorry point five uh
[32:49] uh of a dollar uh for for every dollar you
[32:52] of a dollar uh for for every dollar you spend
[32:53] spend in order to get up to uh the platinum
[32:55] in order to get up to uh the platinum level where it's actually
[32:56] level where it's actually makes sense right so you're not likely
[32:58] makes sense right so you're not likely to join the program
[32:59] to join the program and you'll just go straight to air
[33:01] and you'll just go straight to air canada which again this is
[33:03] canada which again this is one of my problems with with the program
[33:05] one of my problems with with the program and the people that run it is that
[33:07] and the people that run it is that you know it's cutting off your nose to
[33:09] you know it's cutting off your nose to spite your face
[33:10] spite your face sure you're you're making more attracted
[33:12] sure you're you're making more attracted to the platinum members but
[33:14] to the platinum members but what happens to your funnel of people
[33:15] what happens to your funnel of people that are growing into the program
[33:17] that are growing into the program they're not going to get started
[33:18] they're not going to get started because the the the value proposition at
[33:20] because the the the value proposition at the low end is so poor
[33:22] the low end is so poor that um you're they're likely to start
[33:24] that um you're they're likely to start another program
[33:25] another program so i these are some of the things that
[33:27] so i these are some of the things that weren't considered
[33:29] weren't considered um when they relaunched the program and
[33:32] um when they relaunched the program and introduced the platinum tier uh and you
[33:35] introduced the platinum tier uh and you know you don't hear a lot about it
[33:36] know you don't hear a lot about it because
[33:37] because you know people that are new into the
[33:38] you know people that are new into the program or or teal members
[33:41] program or or teal members uh or even silver members they tend not
[33:43] uh or even silver members they tend not to be the ones that
[33:45] to be the ones that are very uh engaged with programs so
[33:48] are very uh engaged with programs so they don't tend to complain a lot
[33:49] they don't tend to complain a lot they're not the ones on fire talk right
[33:51] they're not the ones on fire talk right and they're not the ones uh
[33:52] and they're not the ones uh yelling and uh getting news stories
[33:54] yelling and uh getting news stories printed about it but um
[33:56] printed about it but um you know i can tell you what happened
[33:58] you know i can tell you what happened though you guys are sorry don't yell
[33:59] though you guys are sorry don't yell ever
[34:03] but yeah i mean like i think uh in
[34:05] but yeah i mean like i think uh in general i think long
[34:06] general i think long term i think the westjet program's in a
[34:08] term i think the westjet program's in a lot of trouble because uh
[34:10] lot of trouble because uh they have really reduced the funnel in
[34:11] they have really reduced the funnel in terms of number of people that are
[34:13] terms of number of people that are wanting to join the program
[34:14] wanting to join the program organically that that is a big hurdle to
[34:18] organically that that is a big hurdle to get over that deal when i look at the
[34:19] get over that deal when i look at the dollar requirements
[34:20] dollar requirements and i mean that whole thing about the
[34:22] and i mean that whole thing about the dollars i unders
[34:24] dollars i unders i i feel like that's i can see how it's
[34:28] i i feel like that's i can see how it's it's some it's clear and it makes sense
[34:31] it's some it's clear and it makes sense to the bottom line but i also feel like
[34:33] to the bottom line but i also feel like there was something
[34:34] there was something so magical across the world across
[34:37] so magical across the world across flyers
[34:37] flyers of a mile and it captivated
[34:41] of a mile and it captivated 30 40 years of travelers with this
[34:43] 30 40 years of travelers with this incredible marketing innovation
[34:45] incredible marketing innovation and however you made it work there was
[34:48] and however you made it work there was something almost democratic in one sense
[34:50] something almost democratic in one sense but incredibly elitist in another
[34:52] but incredibly elitist in another and it captivated people and the dollars
[34:54] and it captivated people and the dollars like i said the
[34:55] like i said the new united program i i used to be a 1k
[34:58] new united program i i used to be a 1k flyer i don't i didn't even invest the
[34:59] flyer i don't i didn't even invest the time to
[35:00] time to try to understand the pops and the this
[35:03] try to understand the pops and the this and that
[35:04] and that it it just doesn't connect to travel i
[35:06] it it just doesn't connect to travel i love
[35:07] love yeah and i you know i had this argument
[35:09] yeah and i you know i had this argument many many times
[35:10] many many times is that you know the whole world runs on
[35:14] is that you know the whole world runs on miles and points
[35:15] miles and points like do you think that somehow the
[35:18] like do you think that somehow the entire loyalty world that's been
[35:20] entire loyalty world that's been established for
[35:21] established for you know 40 50 years that they missed
[35:24] you know 40 50 years that they missed the boat and you got it right with
[35:25] the boat and you got it right with dollars like you're the only program
[35:27] dollars like you're the only program that does this
[35:29] that does this and do you think that you're right i
[35:31] and do you think that you're right i just don't understand
[35:32] just don't understand how how they've stayed with westjet
[35:34] how how they've stayed with westjet dollars for so long and
[35:36] dollars for so long and uh you know i'm quite passionate about
[35:38] uh you know i'm quite passionate about this idea but um
[35:39] this idea but um you know the whole idea was at the start
[35:41] you know the whole idea was at the start of the program was to make it easy to
[35:43] of the program was to make it easy to understand
[35:44] understand for canadians and easy to redeem and it
[35:46] for canadians and easy to redeem and it is
[35:47] is um but again you know you spend uh
[35:50] um but again you know you spend uh you know thousands of dollars and you
[35:52] you know thousands of dollars and you end up with you know 150 westjet dollars
[35:54] end up with you know 150 westjet dollars and most people are just gonna
[35:56] and most people are just gonna take that off the price of the ticket
[35:57] take that off the price of the ticket that they pay retail
[35:59] that they pay retail and like that's not rewarding at all
[36:01] and like that's not rewarding at all like it doesn't feel free it doesn't
[36:03] like it doesn't feel free it doesn't feel like you're
[36:04] feel like you're really benefiting from the program um
[36:06] really benefiting from the program um you know they do have one
[36:08] you know they do have one real decent benefit with a credit card
[36:10] real decent benefit with a credit card which is the uh
[36:11] which is the uh the travel uh companion voucher which um
[36:14] the travel uh companion voucher which um previously was quite good um at uh
[36:16] previously was quite good um at uh domestically you could fly
[36:18] domestically you could fly 99 um return
[36:22] 99 um return uh as long as you bought a base fare for
[36:24] uh as long as you bought a base fare for the first person
[36:25] the first person and not even allowed you to go into the
[36:28] and not even allowed you to go into the the premium economy or the the european
[36:31] the premium economy or the the european business class i talked about
[36:32] business class i talked about so it could save you quite a bit of
[36:34] so it could save you quite a bit of money so if you say for example flew
[36:37] money so if you say for example flew vancouver to new york and flew in um
[36:40] vancouver to new york and flew in um westjet premium economy um you know
[36:43] westjet premium economy um you know maybe that costs you
[36:45] maybe that costs you i don't know fifteen hundred dollars
[36:46] i don't know fifteen hundred dollars return um but the second person would be
[36:48] return um but the second person would be ninety nine dollars plus tax which is
[36:50] ninety nine dollars plus tax which is pretty
[36:50] pretty it's a it's a interesting value
[36:52] it's a it's a interesting value proposition but
[36:54] proposition but not everyone took advantage of it uh you
[36:56] not everyone took advantage of it uh you know about 50
[36:57] know about 50 of people that have those uh
[37:00] of people that have those uh certificates end up
[37:01] certificates end up cashing them in so um you know it is
[37:04] cashing them in so um you know it is one of those things uh in the credit
[37:06] one of those things uh in the credit card program that um
[37:08] card program that um is a benefit that people think they're
[37:10] is a benefit that people think they're going to use but end up not using
[37:12] going to use but end up not using um you know much much like the vouchers
[37:14] um you know much much like the vouchers that you get from all the programs is
[37:15] that you get from all the programs is that you know sure it looks good i've
[37:16] that you know sure it looks good i've got 30 vouchers in my
[37:18] got 30 vouchers in my or e-credits in my account but you know
[37:20] or e-credits in my account but you know i don't fly them or use them so
[37:22] i don't fly them or use them so really when you get the mental pressure
[37:23] really when you get the mental pressure i've got to spend more money than i
[37:25] i've got to spend more money than i intended and travel i didn't
[37:27] intended and travel i didn't then just they feel like i'm relieved
[37:29] then just they feel like i'm relieved that i've used them
[37:30] that i've used them that's right exactly so yeah i mean i
[37:32] that's right exactly so yeah i mean i had an interesting history and
[37:34] had an interesting history and ultimately
[37:35] ultimately the reason i left um to come to this uh
[37:37] the reason i left um to come to this uh to worley who i work for now
[37:39] to worley who i work for now is that um i saw the writing on the wall
[37:42] is that um i saw the writing on the wall in that
[37:43] in that um you know some of the things i was
[37:45] um you know some of the things i was trying to do in terms of revamping the
[37:46] trying to do in terms of revamping the member exclusive program to make it more
[37:48] member exclusive program to make it more lucrative
[37:50] lucrative i saw it hitting brick walls all the
[37:52] i saw it hitting brick walls all the time and i didn't see
[37:55] time and i didn't see the vision of it being realized for two
[37:58] the vision of it being realized for two three four five years and i just i
[38:01] three four five years and i just i couldn't sit idly by as i knew that the
[38:03] couldn't sit idly by as i knew that the program
[38:04] program was you know going turning uh downwards
[38:07] was you know going turning uh downwards and i didn't want to be um responsible
[38:10] and i didn't want to be um responsible for it
[38:10] for it uh you know as it got eaten up because i
[38:13] uh you know as it got eaten up because i knew
[38:14] knew air canada was going to be relaunching
[38:15] air canada was going to be relaunching their program and i knew that they were
[38:17] their program and i knew that they were going to make some
[38:18] going to make some uh interesting uh additions to their
[38:20] uh interesting uh additions to their their program to make it more
[38:22] their program to make it more palatable and interesting to people or
[38:24] palatable and interesting to people or canadians
[38:25] canadians um and and so ultimately um
[38:28] um and and so ultimately um i just i didn't see a path forward there
[38:30] i just i didn't see a path forward there and decided that uh you know i
[38:32] and decided that uh you know i should get out and um well number one
[38:35] should get out and um well number one you may
[38:35] you may may or not know may or may not know but
[38:37] may or not know may or may not know but the airline industry does not pay well
[38:39] the airline industry does not pay well um at all and so i actually took a fifty
[38:42] um at all and so i actually took a fifty percent pay cut to go to area to westjet
[38:44] percent pay cut to go to area to westjet um and so now that i'm back in the
[38:47] um and so now that i'm back in the industry i figured that
[38:48] industry i figured that um rather than change the program from
[38:51] um rather than change the program from within um
[38:52] within um you know i'll just earn extra money and
[38:53] you know i'll just earn extra money and fly whoever it was
[38:55] fly whoever it was [Laughter]
[38:59] that last one just curious uh
[39:03] that last one just curious uh your your prediction and people are
[39:05] your your prediction and people are calling the death of airline alliances
[39:07] calling the death of airline alliances up until this year
[39:08] up until this year and then it's joint ventures it's deep
[39:10] and then it's joint ventures it's deep investment and then the travel
[39:12] investment and then the travel industry has this massive collapse with
[39:15] industry has this massive collapse with the pandemic and i'm wondering is uh
[39:18] the pandemic and i'm wondering is uh you know it is an alliance is sky team
[39:21] you know it is an alliance is sky team in the future for westjet
[39:23] in the future for westjet is it just hang out in the delta joint
[39:25] is it just hang out in the delta joint venture is it going alone more
[39:26] venture is it going alone more partnerships what what is an airline
[39:28] partnerships what what is an airline like westjet that
[39:29] like westjet that has growth ambitions do in the current
[39:32] has growth ambitions do in the current environment
[39:33] environment well i can tell you that um when when i
[39:35] well i can tell you that um when when i took over the program
[39:36] took over the program uh there was an intent to actually
[39:38] uh there was an intent to actually launch three new partners
[39:39] launch three new partners uh and i can't tell you who those were
[39:41] uh and i can't tell you who those were but uh
[39:43] but uh uh the intent was to grow by two or
[39:45] uh the intent was to grow by two or three partners every year uh
[39:47] three partners every year uh and i did talk to um the network
[39:50] and i did talk to um the network guys uh and uh the the guys that
[39:53] guys uh and uh the the guys that held the strong the partnership
[39:55] held the strong the partnership relationships uh with
[39:57] relationships uh with with our current partners which were
[39:58] with our current partners which were delta air france klm and qantas
[40:01] delta air france klm and qantas and i asked the question uh because that
[40:04] and i asked the question uh because that that is um
[40:05] that is um you know typically uh people are are
[40:08] you know typically uh people are are often speculating that westjet
[40:10] often speculating that westjet is kind of ideal to join sky team
[40:12] is kind of ideal to join sky team especially with a strong jv with delta
[40:14] especially with a strong jv with delta um and i asked that question and the
[40:16] um and i asked that question and the response back from the guy who led that
[40:18] response back from the guy who led that group was that
[40:19] group was that um never in a million years are we gonna
[40:21] um never in a million years are we gonna join an alliance um
[40:23] join an alliance um and so i i kind of got a sense from that
[40:26] and so i i kind of got a sense from that conversation that
[40:27] conversation that uh i think the days of alliances um
[40:31] uh i think the days of alliances um growing and adding more members uh are
[40:34] growing and adding more members uh are probably
[40:34] probably long gone i think that jv's and
[40:37] long gone i think that jv's and partnerships are probably the way
[40:38] partnerships are probably the way they're going to work in the future i
[40:40] they're going to work in the future i think there's just
[40:41] think there's just there's just more flexibility um with
[40:44] there's just more flexibility um with the airline being able to set their own
[40:45] the airline being able to set their own rules and and
[40:46] rules and and work with whomever they want as a
[40:49] work with whomever they want as a partner rather than
[40:51] partner rather than joining an alliance and kind of being
[40:52] joining an alliance and kind of being very uh restricted in what you can and
[40:55] very uh restricted in what you can and can't do
[40:56] can't do uh and you know i don't know for certain
[40:58] uh and you know i don't know for certain but you know i get a sense that
[40:59] but you know i get a sense that you know as you join an alliance uh
[41:02] you know as you join an alliance uh you're kind of the low man on the totem
[41:03] you're kind of the low man on the totem pole you don't get to make a whole lot
[41:05] pole you don't get to make a whole lot of decisions and you may have a vote
[41:07] of decisions and you may have a vote but the founding members typically are
[41:09] but the founding members typically are the ones that end up making the
[41:10] the ones that end up making the decisions
[41:11] decisions uh and you kind of have to fall in line
[41:13] uh and you kind of have to fall in line with it and um you know that
[41:15] with it and um you know that i'm sure the the financial structures
[41:16] i'm sure the the financial structures are not always the most conducive to
[41:19] are not always the most conducive to small airlines
[41:20] small airlines uh and so you know i just i can't see
[41:23] uh and so you know i just i can't see uh westjet ever joining an alliance uh
[41:26] uh westjet ever joining an alliance uh for that reason and many others
[41:27] for that reason and many others um but you know having a strong jv
[41:30] um but you know having a strong jv partnership
[41:31] partnership um with delta is was a top priority
[41:34] um with delta is was a top priority and i do know that the intent was to
[41:37] and i do know that the intent was to have
[41:38] have uh westjet join in another strong
[41:41] uh westjet join in another strong jv partnership with another
[41:44] jv partnership with another airline that controlled a region like
[41:47] airline that controlled a region like europe for example so
[41:48] europe for example so maybe it was klm or air france or that
[41:51] maybe it was klm or air france or that that
[41:52] that group of group of companies but
[41:55] group of group of companies but essentially
[41:56] essentially i think their intent was to establish
[41:59] i think their intent was to establish strong jv partnerships uh
[42:01] strong jv partnerships uh on the continents that they wanted to
[42:03] on the continents that they wanted to travel or wanted to have connections
[42:04] travel or wanted to have connections into
[42:05] into rather than join an alliance um
[42:08] rather than join an alliance um that's that's a disconnect i feel as a
[42:11] that's that's a disconnect i feel as a traveler where
[42:12] traveler where yeah i round the world i know what
[42:14] yeah i round the world i know what stargold is i know what sky priority is
[42:16] stargold is i know what sky priority is i'm a delta diamond i don't have a clue
[42:18] i'm a delta diamond i don't have a clue what i'm getting on uh westjet and it
[42:20] what i'm getting on uh westjet and it certainly wasn't
[42:21] certainly wasn't selection but the audience has been
[42:24] selection but the audience has been patiently waiting for
[42:26] patiently waiting for uh aeroplan okay great shaver traveler
[42:30] uh aeroplan okay great shaver traveler century club canada he's he had a
[42:31] century club canada he's he had a marketing background in shock
[42:33] marketing background in shock uh that bean counter is in charge of a
[42:35] uh that bean counter is in charge of a consumer marketing program uh
[42:37] consumer marketing program uh air canada elite since 89 he's redeemed
[42:40] air canada elite since 89 he's redeemed over five million miles he
[42:42] over five million miles he tried westjet for the first time in 2019
[42:45] tried westjet for the first time in 2019 pretty good for
[42:46] pretty good for one hour flights but he's very curious
[42:49] one hour flights but he's very curious what do you think of the new air canada
[42:51] what do you think of the new air canada aeroplan program
[42:52] aeroplan program especially for elite super elite members
[42:55] especially for elite super elite members this is launching in november yeah i
[42:58] this is launching in november yeah i mean for
[42:59] mean for elite and super elites i i mean i'm i'm
[43:02] elite and super elites i i mean i'm i'm a 50k member
[43:03] a 50k member uh of air canada and i have to say that
[43:06] uh of air canada and i have to say that um you know someone that has seen both
[43:09] um you know someone that has seen both sides and understands
[43:10] sides and understands why air canada and aeroplane are doing
[43:12] why air canada and aeroplane are doing this
[43:13] this i i'm actually struggling to understand
[43:18] i i'm actually struggling to understand the value that you're going to receive
[43:20] the value that you're going to receive as a top tier member
[43:22] as a top tier member with the eric air canada and aero plan
[43:25] with the eric air canada and aero plan i think that you know a lot of the
[43:27] i think that you know a lot of the benefits that you
[43:28] benefits that you would normally covet as a top tier
[43:31] would normally covet as a top tier member
[43:32] member like lounge access and
[43:35] like lounge access and same day change and all those kinds of
[43:37] same day change and all those kinds of things
[43:38] things they're all going to be available for um
[43:42] they're all going to be available for um what i believe is a 600 credit card
[43:45] what i believe is a 600 credit card annual fee credit card so realistically
[43:49] annual fee credit card so realistically you can't get into um the
[43:52] you can't get into um the uh the international lounges uh for air
[43:55] uh the international lounges uh for air canada and the maple leaf lounges until
[43:57] canada and the maple leaf lounges until you're i believe 35k
[43:59] you're i believe 35k um but essentially for that 600 credit
[44:01] um but essentially for that 600 credit card
[44:02] card you're you're more into the 50k
[44:04] you're you're more into the 50k territory the benefits of 50k
[44:07] territory the benefits of 50k excuse me so um i think that you know i
[44:10] excuse me so um i think that you know i i would be concerned or i am concerned
[44:12] i would be concerned or i am concerned as an air canada frequent flyer
[44:14] as an air canada frequent flyer that you know people are just going to
[44:15] that you know people are just going to get the credit card and the lounges
[44:17] get the credit card and the lounges um the maple leaf lounges are nice um
[44:20] um the maple leaf lounges are nice um but they were already crowded um the top
[44:22] but they were already crowded um the top there's quite a few top tier members
[44:24] there's quite a few top tier members with any care in in canada
[44:26] with any care in in canada that are part of the program that have
[44:27] that are part of the program that have lounge access and now
[44:29] lounge access and now um as you can imagine as as this you
[44:32] um as you can imagine as as this you know
[44:33] know sure it's it's an expensive annual fee
[44:35] sure it's it's an expensive annual fee credit card but if you're getting lounge
[44:37] credit card but if you're getting lounge access
[44:37] access if you're getting uh you know priority
[44:40] if you're getting uh you know priority baggage you're getting priority
[44:41] baggage you're getting priority security you're getting uh front of line
[44:43] security you're getting uh front of line service at the counters
[44:45] service at the counters you're getting same day change you know
[44:48] you're getting same day change you know if you're doing that what what's the
[44:50] if you're doing that what what's the benefit of uh
[44:51] benefit of uh flying air canada i mean they do have a
[44:53] flying air canada i mean they do have a few things that are interesting
[44:54] few things that are interesting uh in the program uh like uh you can
[44:57] uh in the program uh like uh you can convey your benefits uh through a
[44:59] convey your benefits uh through a certificate to a friend or family member
[45:01] certificate to a friend or family member and show them what it's like to be a top
[45:02] and show them what it's like to be a top tier member
[45:03] tier member again you know if that person just got
[45:05] again you know if that person just got the credit card they get the same thing
[45:07] the credit card they get the same thing um but they do have uh um
[45:10] um but they do have uh um you know 50 reduction on aeroplan uh
[45:13] you know 50 reduction on aeroplan uh redemptions
[45:14] redemptions uh you get us you'll get a certificate
[45:16] uh you get us you'll get a certificate uh to depending on what level you're at
[45:19] uh to depending on what level you're at you'll get a certain number of
[45:20] you'll get a certain number of certificates
[45:21] certificates um and it means that you can redeem for
[45:24] um and it means that you can redeem for you know say for example you wanted to
[45:25] you know say for example you wanted to go to um
[45:27] go to um i don't know from vancouver to to new
[45:30] i don't know from vancouver to to new york
[45:30] york the same example i've always been using
[45:32] the same example i've always been using um with the top tier member you can
[45:34] um with the top tier member you can redeem a certificate and if
[45:36] redeem a certificate and if if that round trip was say um i don't
[45:39] if that round trip was say um i don't know sixty seventy thousand dollars in
[45:40] know sixty seventy thousand dollars in business class
[45:42] business class i'm sorry points in business class um
[45:44] i'm sorry points in business class um you can redeem that voucher for 50
[45:46] you can redeem that voucher for 50 off which is which is nice but um you
[45:48] off which is which is nice but um you know i think it it
[45:49] know i think it it it still doesn't address the fact that
[45:52] it still doesn't address the fact that um you're losing you you become less
[45:54] um you're losing you you become less elite i guess you would say and i think
[45:56] elite i guess you would say and i think that you know stefan you you're a
[45:58] that you know stefan you you're a frequent flyer
[45:59] frequent flyer and and i remember when i got my first
[46:03] and and i remember when i got my first status
[46:03] status and how proud i was that status and how
[46:06] and how proud i was that status and how hard i had to work that status
[46:08] hard i had to work that status um and now knowing that you know some
[46:11] um and now knowing that you know some some joe blow
[46:12] some joe blow who never flew a day in his life with
[46:14] who never flew a day in his life with air canada now has a 600
[46:16] air canada now has a 600 credit card and can now get all the
[46:18] credit card and can now get all the benefits that i earn
[46:20] benefits that i earn i think i'd be i'd be pretty peeved i
[46:22] i think i'd be i'd be pretty peeved i mean i i think i might
[46:23] mean i i think i might kick myself for making the mistake of
[46:25] kick myself for making the mistake of flying that much uh and
[46:26] flying that much uh and and rather would have just gotten the
[46:27] and rather would have just gotten the credit card so i think you know
[46:30] credit card so i think you know it'll be interesting because they've
[46:31] it'll be interesting because they've when they launched the program they said
[46:32] when they launched the program they said they're
[46:33] they're they've they've told us about 60 of what
[46:35] they've they've told us about 60 of what the program is
[46:37] the program is so it'll be interesting if the remaining
[46:38] so it'll be interesting if the remaining 40 is more concentrated on showing um
[46:42] 40 is more concentrated on showing um some love to the the top tier members
[46:44] some love to the the top tier members within air canada
[46:45] within air canada um because that right now i have
[46:47] um because that right now i have significant concerns about um
[46:49] significant concerns about um uh the elites and and how how you meet
[46:52] uh the elites and and how how you meet the feel as a top tier member especially
[46:53] the feel as a top tier member especially if you're
[46:54] if you're going to the the the uh the lounge and
[46:57] going to the the the uh the lounge and you're seeing like
[46:57] you're seeing like you know it even more crowded than it
[46:59] you know it even more crowded than it already is uh and
[47:01] already is uh and uh you know and and couple that with the
[47:03] uh you know and and couple that with the fact that kovit is has taken away
[47:05] fact that kovit is has taken away the the uh you know a la carte food and
[47:09] the the uh you know a la carte food and now your bag lunch and now it's like you
[47:11] now your bag lunch and now it's like you know it's it's almost not even worth
[47:13] know it's it's almost not even worth going to the lounge anymore so
[47:15] going to the lounge anymore so it's it's interesting that they've gone
[47:17] it's it's interesting that they've gone that direction
[47:18] that direction um but you know the the side of me that
[47:20] um but you know the the side of me that sees the airline side
[47:22] sees the airline side understands that um why they're doing it
[47:25] understands that um why they're doing it and it
[47:25] and it is to attract more people into the
[47:27] is to attract more people into the program and uh
[47:28] program and uh um you know again it's back to that
[47:30] um you know again it's back to that virtuous cycle if you have that 600
[47:32] virtuous cycle if you have that 600 credit card
[47:33] credit card you see how well you're treated with
[47:34] you see how well you're treated with that benefit and maybe you want to earn
[47:36] that benefit and maybe you want to earn it for yourself legitimately
[47:38] it for yourself legitimately maybe you want to be 100k but even if
[47:41] maybe you want to be 100k but even if you don't
[47:41] you don't um you sign up for that credit card and
[47:44] um you sign up for that credit card and they have
[47:44] they have uh you know contracts with their
[47:46] uh you know contracts with their financial partners uh to
[47:48] financial partners uh to to have kickbacks on on people that sign
[47:50] to have kickbacks on on people that sign up for the credit cards and for every
[47:52] up for the credit cards and for every at least at westjet you know we we got a
[47:54] at least at westjet you know we we got a percentage of every dollar spent on the
[47:55] percentage of every dollar spent on the credit card
[47:56] credit card uh back as part of our partnership
[47:58] uh back as part of our partnership agreement and so
[48:00] agreement and so you know if you can get more people in
[48:01] you know if you can get more people in the credit card and they're spending
[48:02] the credit card and they're spending money on that credit cards the first uh
[48:04] money on that credit cards the first uh top of wallet credit card
[48:05] top of wallet credit card um then you're going to earn a lot of
[48:06] um then you're going to earn a lot of money for for
[48:09] money for for your program and potentially that means
[48:11] your program and potentially that means that as you earn more and more of that
[48:13] that as you earn more and more of that revenue potentially you can do
[48:15] revenue potentially you can do special things for people that are
[48:17] special things for people that are legitimately in your top tier
[48:19] legitimately in your top tier your membership right maybe that means
[48:21] your membership right maybe that means um you know
[48:22] um you know i know that uh in the past they had
[48:24] i know that uh in the past they had given they had a contest
[48:26] given they had a contest to give somebody a lease for a bmw for a
[48:28] to give somebody a lease for a bmw for a year uh that
[48:29] year uh that someone who won a contest with their
[48:31] someone who won a contest with their canada maybe they start doing more and
[48:33] canada maybe they start doing more and more of those kinds of things right
[48:35] more of those kinds of things right and and really showing them love but
[48:37] and and really showing them love but currently and it's it's current
[48:38] currently and it's it's current iteration i have
[48:39] iteration i have deep concerns about uh how some of these
[48:41] deep concerns about uh how some of these people might be feeling the top in in
[48:43] people might be feeling the top in in air canada's top tier uh elites yeah
[48:46] air canada's top tier uh elites yeah exactly how thrilled i am when a delta
[48:48] exactly how thrilled i am when a delta reserve card holder gets a
[48:50] reserve card holder gets a i breaker on the upgrade list yep but
[48:54] i breaker on the upgrade list yep but i love i love that move yeah
[48:57] i love i love that move yeah and ultimate 100 had like this i just
[49:00] and ultimate 100 had like this i just thought when i heard it it was like the
[49:02] thought when i heard it it was like the ultimate frequent flyer benefit the
[49:05] ultimate frequent flyer benefit the instead of this 50 off whatever the
[49:07] instead of this 50 off whatever the price might be which the price could be
[49:09] price might be which the price could be extremely high right the
[49:10] extremely high right the altitude 100s currently have these what
[49:13] altitude 100s currently have these what is it eight
[49:14] is it eight eight awards a year that they can get at
[49:16] eight awards a year that they can get at the standard award chart price no matter
[49:18] the standard award chart price no matter as long as there's a
[49:20] as long as there's a revenue bill for sale yeah
[49:23] revenue bill for sale yeah and that yes air canada had something
[49:25] and that yes air canada had something similar um
[49:26] similar um and it was called ikk
[49:29] and it was called ikk and uh it basically meant that you could
[49:32] and uh it basically meant that you could you could use
[49:33] you could use i think you had a certain number i
[49:35] i think you had a certain number i didn't have any myself
[49:37] didn't have any myself um but uh you had a certain number that
[49:39] um but uh you had a certain number that you could uh yeah basically call your
[49:41] you could uh yeah basically call your concierge you want to redeem this
[49:42] concierge you want to redeem this this certificate and uh yeah get get a
[49:45] this certificate and uh yeah get get a standard redemption for any seat that
[49:48] standard redemption for any seat that was available on the flight as long as
[49:49] was available on the flight as long as there was one seat left
[49:51] there was one seat left see that to me feels as a frequent flyer
[49:54] see that to me feels as a frequent flyer that
[49:54] that to me even if i paid maybe more miles on
[49:57] to me even if i paid maybe more miles on average
[49:58] average that feels like a better benefit than a
[50:00] that feels like a better benefit than a 50 off voucher
[50:01] 50 off voucher yeah i agree i think that um you know
[50:04] yeah i agree i think that um you know typically if you're using that you're
[50:06] typically if you're using that you're you're kind of in a situation where you
[50:09] you're kind of in a situation where you need it right you like you're not
[50:11] need it right you like you're not if if you need to get to a funeral or or
[50:13] if if you need to get to a funeral or or something or wedding and last minute
[50:15] something or wedding and last minute thing
[50:16] thing um having that ability to take snatch up
[50:19] um having that ability to take snatch up that last seat
[50:20] that last seat uh and not put money out of your pocket
[50:22] uh and not put money out of your pocket for it
[50:23] for it um that's a nice feeling but you know
[50:27] um that's a nice feeling but you know you know you still need award inventory
[50:29] you know you still need award inventory uh for the well
[50:31] uh for the well so the new eric air canada program has
[50:34] so the new eric air canada program has just the classic which is award
[50:35] just the classic which is award inventory and then you can also do
[50:37] inventory and then you can also do uh the revenue pricing and that
[50:39] uh the revenue pricing and that certificate still gives you 50
[50:40] certificate still gives you 50 off um both both types um
[50:43] off um both both types um but you know when you're in that
[50:45] but you know when you're in that situation where you need that last
[50:46] situation where you need that last minute seat
[50:47] minute seat i don't know that you're really carrying
[50:49] i don't know that you're really carrying um about
[50:51] um about 50 back i think you just want the seat
[50:53] 50 back i think you just want the seat at the regular
[50:54] at the regular fair the the regular redemption rate uh
[50:57] fair the the regular redemption rate uh rather than have to dig
[50:58] rather than have to dig in and say okay it feels vip it's just
[51:01] in and say okay it feels vip it's just like
[51:01] like yeah that's in your mind boom you know
[51:06] yeah so yeah i was i mean i think that
[51:09] yeah so yeah i was i mean i think that um
[51:10] um uh the the idea that you can just say to
[51:14] uh the the idea that you can just say to anybody hey
[51:14] anybody hey uh i can i can get any seat i want in
[51:17] uh i can i can get any seat i want in there in canada all i have to do is you
[51:18] there in canada all i have to do is you know as a top remember i
[51:20] know as a top remember i flopped down the certificate and i'm
[51:22] flopped down the certificate and i'm paying uh
[51:23] paying uh you know this this last minute seat to
[51:26] you know this this last minute seat to hawaii at christmas
[51:27] hawaii at christmas i'm paying 40 000 points a return like
[51:31] i'm paying 40 000 points a return like can you do that because i can do that
[51:33] can you do that because i can do that because i'm a top tier member
[51:36] because i'm a top tier member and uh rick saying given the program has
[51:38] and uh rick saying given the program has been repatriated by an airline rather
[51:40] been repatriated by an airline rather than a loyalty company we've been
[51:42] than a loyalty company we've been promised they will look
[51:43] promised they will look after top tier flyers only makes sense
[51:46] after top tier flyers only makes sense so
[51:46] so i'm not sure if he's optimistic and then
[51:49] i'm not sure if he's optimistic and then anthony's saying uh so do you also need
[51:52] anthony's saying uh so do you also need to spend 6 000 cash on ac
[51:53] to spend 6 000 cash on ac flights to keep your 50k or can you just
[51:56] flights to keep your 50k or can you just i guess
[51:57] i guess so he's thinking you get it just with
[51:58] so he's thinking you get it just with their new premier credit cards i think
[51:59] their new premier credit cards i think your point is that
[52:01] your point is that you're not getting the actual status
[52:02] you're not getting the actual status with the credit card but you're getting
[52:04] with the credit card but you're getting kind of benefits that are so similar
[52:05] kind of benefits that are so similar it's just as
[52:06] it's just as exact exactly yeah so um
[52:09] exact exactly yeah so um yeah the benefits are priority security
[52:12] yeah the benefits are priority security priority baggage
[52:13] priority baggage priority check-in uh and lounge access
[52:16] priority check-in uh and lounge access and same day change and so
[52:19] and same day change and so those are all benefits that you would
[52:22] those are all benefits that you would get roughly at the 50k
[52:23] get roughly at the 50k level um and you know
[52:27] level um and you know again you don't get the you don't get
[52:29] again you don't get the you don't get the bag tag you don't get the
[52:31] the bag tag you don't get the welcome letter from uh so but
[52:34] welcome letter from uh so but you get uh you get all the benefits and
[52:37] you get uh you get all the benefits and to me that's really what's important
[52:40] to me that's really what's important now before i ask a heavy closing one on
[52:42] now before i ask a heavy closing one on awards you're booking i see uh
[52:45] awards you're booking i see uh our our correspondent from tokyo uh
[52:47] our our correspondent from tokyo uh shiraishi hiroko of enjoying ffp
[52:50] shiraishi hiroko of enjoying ffp uh jp just joined and i happen to have
[52:53] uh jp just joined and i happen to have seen a lot of
[52:54] seen a lot of sushi and the occasional ramen in your
[52:56] sushi and the occasional ramen in your instagram feed
[52:58] instagram feed so uh calgary tell us what what we
[53:01] so uh calgary tell us what what we should be eating
[53:04] from calgary yes you did you did vote
[53:08] from calgary yes you did you did vote for one one sushi place in calgary
[53:11] for one one sushi place in calgary well i mean my my favorite restaurant in
[53:13] well i mean my my favorite restaurant in calgary is called workshop kitchen and
[53:15] calgary is called workshop kitchen and culture
[53:16] culture uh and it's uh um it's kind of a
[53:19] uh and it's uh um it's kind of a everything is a fusion restaurant
[53:20] everything is a fusion restaurant nowadays but it's a canadian fusion
[53:22] nowadays but it's a canadian fusion restaurant uh and it's uh
[53:24] restaurant uh and it's uh uh really well known uh in terms of the
[53:26] uh really well known uh in terms of the the quality of the food that's there
[53:28] the quality of the food that's there uh and they do something called the low
[53:30] uh and they do something called the low heat lunch and low heat dinner which is
[53:32] heat lunch and low heat dinner which is a
[53:33] a uh chef's option of what they want to
[53:35] uh chef's option of what they want to serve you you don't actually get to
[53:36] serve you you don't actually get to choose just tell them if you have any
[53:37] choose just tell them if you have any allergies
[53:38] allergies and you do a either a three or five
[53:40] and you do a either a three or five course dinner uh for a
[53:42] course dinner uh for a you know decently affordable price it
[53:44] you know decently affordable price it tends to be a
[53:45] tends to be a more of a higher restaurant but some of
[53:48] more of a higher restaurant but some of the best food i've ever had in calgary
[53:49] the best food i've ever had in calgary but you know in terms of um
[53:54] but you know in terms of um there are certainly better restaurants
[53:56] there are certainly better restaurants around the world that i've eaten at
[53:58] around the world that i've eaten at um but for calgary workshop is a
[54:00] um but for calgary workshop is a definite recommendation
[54:02] definite recommendation and uh you know most places here in
[54:04] and uh you know most places here in calgary do a pretty good stay because
[54:05] calgary do a pretty good stay because we're known
[54:06] we're known uh for alberta steak or alberta beef
[54:09] uh for alberta steak or alberta beef and so lots of good steak restaurants
[54:11] and so lots of good steak restaurants here in calgary as well
[54:14] here in calgary as well and tips on cooking a large piece of
[54:16] and tips on cooking a large piece of meat because
[54:18] meat because that figures in your feed as well yeah
[54:21] that figures in your feed as well yeah so i
[54:21] so i um i took up smoking um uh
[54:25] um i took up smoking um uh probably five or six years ago uh built
[54:27] probably five or six years ago uh built my own smoker out of a
[54:29] my own smoker out of a uh an oil drum and uh learned how to
[54:32] uh an oil drum and uh learned how to smoke a brisket
[54:33] smoke a brisket and uh i tried to try to perfect it
[54:36] and uh i tried to try to perfect it and it's it's pretty difficult to be
[54:38] and it's it's pretty difficult to be honest it's there's
[54:39] honest it's there's there's been times when it's turned out
[54:41] there's been times when it's turned out pretty tough or very much like a pot
[54:43] pretty tough or very much like a pot roast
[54:44] roast um but you know for the most part uh
[54:46] um but you know for the most part uh it's been fun but
[54:47] it's been fun but you know i've traveled i've had the uh
[54:50] you know i've traveled i've had the uh the pleasure of eating at uh franklin
[54:52] the pleasure of eating at uh franklin barbecue in austin texas
[54:53] barbecue in austin texas and uh you know he he's a he's a hero of
[54:56] and uh you know he he's a he's a hero of mine and and the way he does his brisket
[54:58] mine and and the way he does his brisket is unbelievable and that's something i
[55:00] is unbelievable and that's something i always strive for
[55:01] always strive for um you know we've got a few barbecue
[55:03] um you know we've got a few barbecue restaurants here um that do a texas
[55:06] restaurants here um that do a texas style barbecue but
[55:07] style barbecue but i mean they don't hold a candle to
[55:09] i mean they don't hold a candle to franklin and some of the barbecue
[55:11] franklin and some of the barbecue i've had in houston and texas and
[55:14] i've had in houston and texas and uh you know a big fan of smoked meats uh
[55:17] uh you know a big fan of smoked meats uh and always striving to try to perfect
[55:19] and always striving to try to perfect the craft but
[55:20] the craft but uh it's an expensive thing to try to
[55:22] uh it's an expensive thing to try to figure out as well you know
[55:23] figure out as well you know you're paying 100 150 bucks for a
[55:26] you're paying 100 150 bucks for a brisket
[55:26] brisket and it could turn out very very poorly
[55:28] and it could turn out very very poorly and because the
[55:30] and because the brisket's so big that you're typically
[55:32] brisket's so big that you're typically inviting you know 20 people to your
[55:33] inviting you know 20 people to your house
[55:34] house and so always very anxious when you're
[55:36] and so always very anxious when you're cutting into it
[55:37] cutting into it as to whether you did a good job or not
[55:39] as to whether you did a good job or not and you know everyone's
[55:40] and you know everyone's very very gracious and tells you you did
[55:43] very very gracious and tells you you did a great job and you know you're chewing
[55:44] a great job and you know you're chewing on beef jerky sometimes so it's not
[55:47] on beef jerky sometimes so it's not it's a it's it's a lot of pressure and
[55:49] it's a it's it's a lot of pressure and it's a lot of time investment but
[55:50] it's a lot of time investment but um just like anything in life i think uh
[55:53] um just like anything in life i think uh anything that
[55:54] anything that you uh do you should try to do well so
[55:58] you uh do you should try to do well so you know it's something i i try to try
[55:59] you know it's something i i try to try to learn and perfect
[56:01] to learn and perfect over time but i'm certainly not at the
[56:02] over time but i'm certainly not at the expert level yet
[56:04] expert level yet navigating a taiwanese night market
[56:06] navigating a taiwanese night market [Laughter]
[56:08] [Laughter] you know what as a traveler i'm not um
[56:11] you know what as a traveler i'm not um i'm not a big fan of crowds to be honest
[56:13] i'm not a big fan of crowds to be honest and um night markets
[56:16] and um night markets are exactly that they're noisy a lot of
[56:19] are exactly that they're noisy a lot of people
[56:20] people um here's a hot tip that i'm sure a lot
[56:22] um here's a hot tip that i'm sure a lot of people already know but don't travel
[56:24] of people already know but don't travel to asia in
[56:25] to asia in august or july it's ridiculous
[56:30] august or july it's ridiculous my parents weren't my parents are from
[56:31] my parents weren't my parents are from taiwan and we went uh i told them we
[56:33] taiwan and we went uh i told them we were going to taiwan
[56:35] were going to taiwan and they asked us when we're going and
[56:36] and they asked us when we're going and uh you know i'd heard all the time like
[56:38] uh you know i'd heard all the time like november is a really good time
[56:40] november is a really good time and i said august and then like you're
[56:42] and i said august and then like you're insane i'm like
[56:43] insane i'm like how bad could it be i mean i we've had
[56:45] how bad could it be i mean i we've had like you know 40 degrees every once in a
[56:47] like you know 40 degrees every once in a while here in calgary
[56:49] while here in calgary um but yeah i know it's it's ridiculous
[56:51] um but yeah i know it's it's ridiculous you don't want to ever do it
[56:53] you don't want to ever do it um so you know there were the the food
[56:56] um so you know there were the the food at the night markets are incredible
[56:58] at the night markets are incredible um and it's so cheap but it was so
[57:01] um and it's so cheap but it was so hot that you know we we'd gone to
[57:04] hot that you know we we'd gone to rohi market and we
[57:08] rohi market and we had this pepper pork bun which is very
[57:10] had this pepper pork bun which is very famous and it was unbelievably delicious
[57:12] famous and it was unbelievably delicious it was so good that i was dreaming about
[57:14] it was so good that i was dreaming about it um but
[57:15] it um but uh i didn't want to go back to the
[57:17] uh i didn't want to go back to the market because it was so hot even at
[57:19] market because it was so hot even at like nine at night
[57:20] like nine at night so my daughter and i we made a pact and
[57:22] so my daughter and i we made a pact and we we went
[57:24] we we went late at night and i just took train
[57:26] late at night and i just took train grabbed some buns and jumped back on the
[57:28] grabbed some buns and jumped back on the air conditioned train
[57:28] air conditioned train and back to the hotel it didn't stick
[57:30] and back to the hotel it didn't stick around so um
[57:32] around so um you know i would say that uh you know
[57:34] you know i would say that uh you know when you go to those night markets
[57:35] when you go to those night markets um go on an empty stomach and and just
[57:38] um go on an empty stomach and and just try everything because it's so
[57:40] try everything because it's so cheap like your that pepper pork bun i
[57:42] cheap like your that pepper pork bun i think was a dollar fifty canadian
[57:44] think was a dollar fifty canadian and it was really filling you could get
[57:46] and it was really filling you could get dumplings like
[57:47] dumplings like uh like six or ten dumplings for like 70
[57:50] uh like six or ten dumplings for like 70 cents it's just
[57:51] cents it's just ridiculous uh and the food is so good
[57:53] ridiculous uh and the food is so good but uh
[57:54] but uh again try not to go when it's uh 40
[57:56] again try not to go when it's uh 40 degrees and 85 percent humidity
[58:00] degrees and 85 percent humidity taiwan's one of the first targets if if
[58:02] taiwan's one of the first targets if if uh covered related
[58:04] uh covered related yeah uh travel were to open up but it
[58:06] yeah uh travel were to open up but it wouldn't
[58:07] wouldn't yeah as i said it'd be november to
[58:08] yeah as i said it'd be november to february
[58:13] how about a koala experience on the list
[58:17] how about a koala experience on the list of top things you can do as a parent
[58:19] of top things you can do as a parent yeah as a as a parent um
[58:23] yeah as a as a parent um i love surprising my family uh and this
[58:25] i love surprising my family uh and this is kind of it's become such a mo that
[58:27] is kind of it's become such a mo that they expect surprises now so it kind of
[58:29] they expect surprises now so it kind of has lost a bit of its luster but um when
[58:32] has lost a bit of its luster but um when we travel especially on our big trips i
[58:34] we travel especially on our big trips i tend like to do something special
[58:36] tend like to do something special um and uh when we were in in australia
[58:39] um and uh when we were in in australia uh we went and did the koala experience
[58:41] uh we went and did the koala experience and got to pedo koala
[58:43] and got to pedo koala which is you know fairly common to do in
[58:45] which is you know fairly common to do in australia but it was just
[58:46] australia but it was just nice to be able to do but one of the
[58:48] nice to be able to do but one of the kind of the most
[58:50] kind of the most memorable things that we ever did um on
[58:52] memorable things that we ever did um on a day in cape town
[58:53] a day in cape town uh we went to a cheetah reserve and um
[58:56] uh we went to a cheetah reserve and um we got a chance to play with a meerkat
[58:59] we got a chance to play with a meerkat and
[59:00] and pet a cheetah and that was an incredible
[59:03] pet a cheetah and that was an incredible experience
[59:04] experience and that same day we went to a monkey
[59:06] and that same day we went to a monkey zoo
[59:07] zoo and got to play with monkeys as well and
[59:09] and got to play with monkeys as well and they were eating marshmallows off our
[59:10] they were eating marshmallows off our shoulders and
[59:11] shoulders and and out of our hands and things like
[59:13] and out of our hands and things like that so you know those are
[59:15] that so you know those are those are things that i like to do for
[59:16] those are things that i like to do for my family to try to make it memorable
[59:18] my family to try to make it memorable and
[59:19] and you know one of the things that one of
[59:20] you know one of the things that one of the reasons i want to get my daughter to
[59:22] the reasons i want to get my daughter to 100 countries is that
[59:24] 100 countries is that you know as as i was growing up as a kid
[59:26] you know as as i was growing up as a kid one of the things i i always
[59:28] one of the things i i always kind of thought was that you know the
[59:31] kind of thought was that you know the way we do things in north america
[59:32] way we do things in north america it has to be the right way because you
[59:34] it has to be the right way because you know we we have a pretty great life here
[59:36] know we we have a pretty great life here everything's easy and then all the
[59:39] everything's easy and then all the things you read about
[59:40] things you read about in your social studies books like um you
[59:42] in your social studies books like um you know
[59:43] know about japan or germany or whatever
[59:45] about japan or germany or whatever during world war
[59:46] during world war ii um that's all you really know about
[59:48] ii um that's all you really know about the world and um
[59:50] the world and um you really don't broaden your horizons
[59:51] you really don't broaden your horizons and it really kind of when i when i
[59:54] and it really kind of when i when i finally got a chance to travel when i
[59:55] finally got a chance to travel when i was in my 20s
[59:57] was in my 20s um you start realizing that you know the
[59:59] um you start realizing that you know the the world is a lot bigger and people are
[01:00:01] the world is a lot bigger and people are are people around the world and so i
[01:00:04] are people around the world and so i want her to realize that
[01:00:05] want her to realize that you know north americans ways of doing
[01:00:07] you know north americans ways of doing things is not necessarily the right way
[01:00:10] things is not necessarily the right way it's not the wrong way either it's just
[01:00:11] it's not the wrong way either it's just a way and there are certainly people
[01:00:13] a way and there are certainly people around the world that
[01:00:14] around the world that are a lot worse off than we are that are
[01:00:16] are a lot worse off than we are that are are potentially a lot more happy
[01:00:18] are potentially a lot more happy uh and uh i just want her to understand
[01:00:21] uh and uh i just want her to understand that
[01:00:21] that uh you know there's more of the world
[01:00:23] uh you know there's more of the world than what uh what's laid out in front of
[01:00:25] than what uh what's laid out in front of her
[01:00:25] her and uh so you know as as part of that i
[01:00:28] and uh so you know as as part of that i tried to give
[01:00:29] tried to give uh give her experiences unique
[01:00:31] uh give her experiences unique experiences from around the world
[01:00:33] experiences from around the world um so that she had she can form some of
[01:00:35] um so that she had she can form some of those memories and uh
[01:00:36] those memories and uh maybe have a connection or two from from
[01:00:38] maybe have a connection or two from from people they that
[01:00:40] people they that she's dealt with uh from around the
[01:00:42] she's dealt with uh from around the world so she the world doesn't
[01:00:44] world so she the world doesn't seem as scary as as it did to me uh when
[01:00:46] seem as scary as as it did to me uh when i was growing up and and uh you know
[01:00:49] i was growing up and and uh you know the idea of traveling to far-flung
[01:00:51] the idea of traveling to far-flung places um
[01:00:52] places um where you know uh there were there were
[01:00:55] where you know uh there were there were atrocities committed uh
[01:00:57] atrocities committed uh you know it didn't seem all that
[01:00:59] you know it didn't seem all that appealing seemed scary you know i
[01:01:00] appealing seemed scary you know i remember reading about rwanda
[01:01:02] remember reading about rwanda uh and the genocide that happened wasn't
[01:01:04] uh and the genocide that happened wasn't when i was in high school and i think
[01:01:05] when i was in high school and i think i'm like there's no way i'd ever want to
[01:01:06] i'm like there's no way i'd ever want to visit there but now
[01:01:08] visit there but now you know rwanda see is very high on my
[01:01:10] you know rwanda see is very high on my bucket list of places i'd like to visit
[01:01:12] bucket list of places i'd like to visit you know it's it's
[01:01:12] you know it's it's it's apparently the the new the
[01:01:14] it's apparently the the new the singapore of asia and you know or the
[01:01:16] singapore of asia and you know or the the singer the the brightest country
[01:01:20] the singer the the brightest country in the african continent and uh so i
[01:01:23] in the african continent and uh so i think there's there's
[01:01:24] think there's there's a lot to be said about um forming
[01:01:26] a lot to be said about um forming opinions of places you've never been to
[01:01:28] opinions of places you've never been to uh and so uh you know like like i said i
[01:01:31] uh and so uh you know like like i said i i try to
[01:01:32] i try to try to give her as many good memories as
[01:01:34] try to give her as many good memories as possible so that she feels comfortable
[01:01:36] possible so that she feels comfortable in going back when she's an adult and
[01:01:37] in going back when she's an adult and raising her kids the same way
[01:01:40] raising her kids the same way wonderful golfing as a lefty yeah
[01:01:43] wonderful golfing as a lefty yeah um clubs are tend to be cheap because
[01:01:46] um clubs are tend to be cheap because they typically can't sell the clubs
[01:01:48] they typically can't sell the clubs because there's not that many lefties
[01:01:50] because there's not that many lefties but uh yeah i mean uh interestingly
[01:01:54] but uh yeah i mean uh interestingly uh canada is um the has the highest per
[01:01:57] uh canada is um the has the highest per capita population of lefty golfers in
[01:01:59] capita population of lefty golfers in the world
[01:02:00] the world i have no idea why it probably has to do
[01:02:02] i have no idea why it probably has to do with hockey because i think we're about
[01:02:03] with hockey because i think we're about 50 50 split
[01:02:05] 50 50 split hockey left-handed and right-handed
[01:02:06] hockey left-handed and right-handed players but um i think in the world it's
[01:02:09] players but um i think in the world it's about 10
[01:02:10] about 10 of the world and i think in canada it's
[01:02:11] of the world and i think in canada it's something like 35 or 40 percent
[01:02:14] something like 35 or 40 percent um so uh a lefty in canada is not that
[01:02:17] um so uh a lefty in canada is not that weird but
[01:02:18] weird but um for for other people around the world
[01:02:20] um for for other people around the world it's quite odd
[01:02:22] it's quite odd i had gone on a golf trip to with my
[01:02:24] i had gone on a golf trip to with my buddy to palm springs and uh
[01:02:26] buddy to palm springs and uh we we needed to rent uh two two bags of
[01:02:30] we we needed to rent uh two two bags of left-handed clubs and uh they were
[01:02:32] left-handed clubs and uh they were they're having a hard time fitting our
[01:02:34] they're having a hard time fitting our order
[01:02:34] order because nobody ever came on spring
[01:02:37] because nobody ever came on spring looking for left-hand clubs
[01:02:39] looking for left-hand clubs i'm a lefty and even when i caddied even
[01:02:42] i'm a lefty and even when i caddied even caddying for lefties i would get nervous
[01:02:44] caddying for lefties i would get nervous because i felt like they were going to
[01:02:45] because i felt like they were going to shank it right into my a different look
[01:02:49] shank it right into my a different look yeah golfing in alberta
[01:02:52] yeah golfing in alberta uh you know it's uh it's pretty great we
[01:02:55] uh you know it's uh it's pretty great we have some really nice courses in alberta
[01:02:57] have some really nice courses in alberta especially the mountain courses
[01:02:58] especially the mountain courses um and it tends to be uh not too bad i
[01:03:02] um and it tends to be uh not too bad i mean
[01:03:02] mean in the mountain courses you're looking
[01:03:05] in the mountain courses you're looking between 120 to 150
[01:03:06] between 120 to 150 around um and then carts usually extra
[01:03:10] around um and then carts usually extra on top of that for about 20 to 25 bucks
[01:03:12] on top of that for about 20 to 25 bucks but you know as an american that's
[01:03:14] but you know as an american that's peanuts to you guys i think that's
[01:03:16] peanuts to you guys i think that's 35 cents i think or something like that
[01:03:18] 35 cents i think or something like that for american
[01:03:20] for american um so you know it's actually alberta
[01:03:23] um so you know it's actually alberta that's uh
[01:03:23] that's uh really some really nice golf courses um
[01:03:26] really some really nice golf courses um but the challenges that we have about
[01:03:28] but the challenges that we have about three months of summer that uh you can
[01:03:30] three months of summer that uh you can golf in so it's a challenge
[01:03:31] golf in so it's a challenge uh and we've got quite a few passionate
[01:03:34] uh and we've got quite a few passionate people that love golf in alberta
[01:03:36] people that love golf in alberta uh and because of the limited uh season
[01:03:38] uh and because of the limited uh season that we've got and the limited number of
[01:03:40] that we've got and the limited number of courses that we've got
[01:03:41] courses that we've got uh in comparison to the us for example
[01:03:44] uh in comparison to the us for example it tends to be difficult to get
[01:03:45] it tends to be difficult to get tee time so usually you're booking a
[01:03:47] tee time so usually you're booking a week out if you can get it
[01:03:50] week out if you can get it and sometimes you know we've been
[01:03:52] and sometimes you know we've been getting 7 amt
[01:03:53] getting 7 amt times of recent because that's all
[01:03:55] times of recent because that's all that's really available nowadays
[01:03:57] that's really available nowadays um but uh yeah we often uh um
[01:04:00] um but uh yeah we often uh um try to think about places we can go
[01:04:02] try to think about places we can go golfing in the us but
[01:04:04] golfing in the us but that's probably unlikely to happen this
[01:04:05] that's probably unlikely to happen this year due to covet
[01:04:07] year due to covet but uh yeah we're thinking about what we
[01:04:10] but uh yeah we're thinking about what we can do to keep our golf game going in
[01:04:12] can do to keep our golf game going in the winter
[01:04:12] the winter but it's going to be a bit of a
[01:04:13] but it's going to be a bit of a challenge and we'll close with uh the
[01:04:16] challenge and we'll close with uh the aeroplan awards you're booking before
[01:04:18] aeroplan awards you're booking before november 8th
[01:04:19] november 8th and the awards you're raring to book
[01:04:21] and the awards you're raring to book from november 8th
[01:04:22] from november 8th well you know i've been looking um so as
[01:04:26] well you know i've been looking um so as i mentioned
[01:04:26] i mentioned we're flying singapore back from
[01:04:29] we're flying singapore back from singapore
[01:04:31] singapore and uh i'm actually looking at booking
[01:04:34] and uh i'm actually looking at booking after
[01:04:34] after because i'm trying to get on i've always
[01:04:37] because i'm trying to get on i've always wanted to fly the fonza first
[01:04:39] wanted to fly the fonza first but i could never fathom paying that
[01:04:41] but i could never fathom paying that much money in surcharge
[01:04:42] much money in surcharge uh so my hope is to try to get us on
[01:04:46] uh so my hope is to try to get us on uh lufthansa from singapore to frankfurt
[01:04:49] uh lufthansa from singapore to frankfurt and frankfurt to
[01:04:50] and frankfurt to uh anywhere in north america and then
[01:04:52] uh anywhere in north america and then find a way back um
[01:04:54] find a way back um and so that that's kind of what i'm
[01:04:56] and so that that's kind of what i'm looking at um i had booked
[01:04:58] looking at um i had booked uh uh how many around the world before
[01:05:00] uh uh how many around the world before they changed the rules uh with their
[01:05:02] they changed the rules uh with their candidate aeroplan
[01:05:03] candidate aeroplan um to go to uh lisbon
[01:05:06] um to go to uh lisbon athens and montreal for a wedding and
[01:05:09] athens and montreal for a wedding and then we were gonna have two
[01:05:10] then we were gonna have two two uh 24-hour stops in cairo in
[01:05:12] two uh 24-hour stops in cairo in istanbul
[01:05:14] istanbul um and so ended up having to cancel that
[01:05:16] um and so ended up having to cancel that but that you know that's kind of
[01:05:18] but that you know that's kind of what i was thinking of trying to do
[01:05:21] what i was thinking of trying to do again if i
[01:05:22] again if i could but as i mentioned we only do one
[01:05:24] could but as i mentioned we only do one really big trip a year
[01:05:25] really big trip a year uh and for me 2020 is kind of a
[01:05:27] uh and for me 2020 is kind of a write-off so i don't expect to book
[01:05:29] write-off so i don't expect to book anything for 2020.
[01:05:30] anything for 2020. 2021 uh we're already going to japan for
[01:05:33] 2021 uh we're already going to japan for sakura season
[01:05:34] sakura season um and then down the same floor just
[01:05:35] um and then down the same floor just because i've always wanted to go to
[01:05:36] because i've always wanted to go to singapore
[01:05:37] singapore um and uh so that you know the
[01:05:40] um and uh so that you know the the the trips i think i've got booked
[01:05:43] the the trips i think i've got booked for 21 have kind of already used up a
[01:05:45] for 21 have kind of already used up a lot of my vacation time
[01:05:47] lot of my vacation time so i'm actually personally not looking
[01:05:48] so i'm actually personally not looking at anything to book
[01:05:50] at anything to book prior to the changeover in fact looking
[01:05:53] prior to the changeover in fact looking forward to the change over so that i can
[01:05:54] forward to the change over so that i can book
[01:05:55] book some of these first class products that
[01:05:57] some of these first class products that were difficult to book due to the
[01:05:58] were difficult to book due to the surcharges
[01:06:00] surcharges fantastic and such a clear
[01:06:04] fantastic and such a clear exponent and uh explainer of the
[01:06:07] exponent and uh explainer of the the loyalty programs from the inside as
[01:06:10] the loyalty programs from the inside as a wonderful session
[01:06:11] a wonderful session thank you for joining us tonight no
[01:06:13] thank you for joining us tonight no problem thank you steven it was great to
[01:06:15] problem thank you steven it was great to talk to you and uh thanks for the
[01:06:16] talk to you and uh thanks for the opportunity to speak with you

Full Transcript

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ly-z8aXk9TY
Translation: zh-TW

[00:12] 我愛加拿大，我愛談論加拿大，所以我們歡迎加拿大貴賓 J. Slow of Points Nerd。
[00:20] 加拿大貴賓 J. Slow of Points Nerd，嗨 Stefan，謝謝你的邀請，嗯，你...
[00:23] 嗨 Stefan，謝謝你的邀請，嗯，你，謝謝你抽空前來，你剛剛接任了一個
[00:25] 一個新的大工作，嗯，對這一切都很好奇，但是，嗯，從你展示的個人資料照片來看，你似乎是一位家庭旅行者
[00:35] 和一位浪人戰士，所以請告訴我們你的旅行檔案是什麼。
[00:39] 嗯，是的，我的意思是，通常，嗯，你知道，我們每年會進行一到兩次大型旅行，通常我喜歡休一個月假，然後進行一次完整的旅行，
[00:53] 通常這意味著盡可能多地去到各大洲，盡可能多地去到新的國家，你知道，我們正試圖做你所做的事情，然後試圖去到所有國家。
[01:02] 然後試圖去到所有國家，但我有一個目標是去到100個國家
[01:05] 但我有一個目標是為我的女兒在她滿18歲前去到100個國家
[01:06] 為我的女兒在她滿18歲前去到100個國家，而她現在
[01:07] 她現在11歲，已經去了大約42個國家，所以
[01:11] 11歲了，去了大約42個國家，所以進展還可以，但你知道這可能有點
[01:13] 進展還可以，但你知道要達到100個可能有點勉強，但我們正在努力
[01:14] 有點勉強要達到100個，但我們正在努力
[01:15] 努力，所以你知道通常我的妻子和我
[01:18] 所以你知道通常我的妻子和我
[01:19] 我會和我們的女兒一起旅行，我們
[01:21] 會和我們的女兒一起旅行，我們喜歡旅行
[01:22] 喜歡坐商務艙旅行，但我們並不
[01:25] 坐商務艙，但我們並不介意偶爾乘坐經濟艙
[01:27] 偶爾乘坐經濟艙，所以通常在
[01:29] 偶爾，所以通常在國內和跨國航班上
[01:32] 國內和跨國航班上，我們通常會乘坐
[01:34] 經濟艙，因為我無法
[01:36] 經濟艙，因為我無法想像
[01:38] 作為亞洲人，我無法想像要為二等商務艙支付雙倍的價格差異
[01:40] 要為二等商務艙支付雙倍的價格差異
[01:41] 支付雙倍的價格給二等商務艙，所以
[01:44] 二等商務艙，所以你知道這就是我們通常的做法
[01:46] 你知道這就是我們通常的家庭旅行方式，然後對我來說，為了
[01:48] 家庭旅行，然後對我來說，為了商務
[01:48] 商務，你知道我確實會出差不少
[01:51] 你知道我確實會出差不少
[01:52] 出差，我的新工作我預計
[01:55] 我的新工作我預計我會做更多的
[01:56] 更多的旅行
[01:56] 旅行，因為那個受人覬覦的危機
[02:00] 受人覬覦的危機的更新，但在此之前，我有點
[02:02] 嗯更新，但嗯，在此之前我有點被困在家裡，在家工作
[02:04] 被困在家裡，在家工作，嗯，渴望旅行，就像我確定一樣
[02:06] 嗯，渴望旅行，就像我確定你們很多人和你們的聽眾一樣
[02:09] 你們很多人和你們的聽眾都渴望做同樣的事情，太棒了
[02:12] 渴望做同樣的事情，太棒了，嗯，那就是三個，那就是一個
[02:14] 嗯，那就是三個，那就是又一個人，這使得
[02:16] 更多的人，這使得它很容易，總的來說，從什麼容易積分
[02:19] 很容易，總的來說，從什麼容易積分旅行，絕對
[02:21] 旅行，絕對，是的，我們正在看，所以我們
[02:23] 是的，我們正在看，所以我們計劃去日本
[02:24] 計劃去日本，嗯，在三月，嗯，我們已經規劃了
[02:27] 嗯，在三月，嗯，我們已經規劃了，嗯，日本航空頭等艙
[02:32] 嗯，日本航空頭等艙，嗯，飛往東京，然後到
[02:34] 嗯，飛往東京，然後到新加坡
[02:36] 新加坡，嗯，從新加坡回來，在那裡
[02:38] 嗯，從新加坡回來，在那裡我們正在乘坐新加坡航空
[02:39] 我們正在乘坐新加坡航空商務艙，但老實說
[02:41] 商務艙，但老實說，我正在考慮更改，因為它
[02:43] 我正在考慮更改，因為它看起來並不那麼吸引人
[02:45] 坦率地說，看起來並不那麼吸引人，我們
[02:46] 坦率地說，我們正在考慮可能使用一些
[02:49] 考慮可能使用我的一些阿拉斯加里程
[02:51] 我擁有的阿拉斯加里程，並乘坐阿聯酋航空頭等艙，嗯，全程
[02:54] 並乘坐阿聯酋航空頭等艙，嗯，全程經杜拜，但嗯，是的
[02:57] 經杜拜，但嗯，是的，容易找到兩個，難找
[02:59] 容易找到兩個，難找三個
[03:02] 關於那個那個，什麼不吸引人
[03:04] 而新加坡選項不吸引人的地方是，你看到的，你看到的，嗯，你知道
[03:08] 嗯，你知道，當我最終搜尋獎勵機票時，我經常做很多
[03:11] 當我最終搜尋獎勵機票時，我經常透過 YouTube 做很多盡職調查，還有
[03:12] 機票，我經常透過 YouTube 做很多盡職調查，還有看很多關於
[03:14] 盡職調查，還有看很多關於產品品質的 YouTube 影片，還有
[03:16] 看很多關於產品品質的 YouTube 影片，還有軟硬體方面
[03:18] 嗯，產品的品質，還有軟硬體方面，而且說實話，它就是
[03:20] 軟硬體方面，而且說實話，它就是看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的那些故事
[03:23] 而且你知道說實話，它就是看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的那些故事
[03:23] 看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡出發的航班
[03:25] 嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯
[03:28] 我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情
[03:29] 嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫
[03:31] 飛往 EWR，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了
[03:34] 不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘
[03:36] 嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬
[03:39] 事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人
[03:40] 或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼
[03:42] 阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼吸引人，當你考慮到
[03:43] 點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼吸引人，當你考慮到，嗯，咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。
[03:46] 吸引人，當你考慮到，嗯，咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點
[03:48] 咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點，嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在
[03:52] 嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點，嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候
[03:55] 嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了
[03:58] 在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是
[03:59] 在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是
[04:01] 在那裡，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是
[04:03] 看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是
[04:05] 寬敞的商務艙座位，我一直想嘗試，但是。
[04:06] 想嘗試，但是嗯，現在我有些保留，但是。
[04:09] 嗯，現在我有些保留，但我不知道你是否乘坐過，
[04:10] 我不知道你是否乘坐過，是否有任何意見，但我會
[04:13] 有任何意見，但我很想聽聽你對此的看法。
[04:16] 想聽聽你對此的看法，我在寫部落格時學到，如果我說
[04:18] 我在寫部落格時學到，如果我說，即使是絲毫的
[04:20] 對新加坡的批評，有人
[04:23] 對新加坡的批評，有人，擁有新加坡IP地址的人，他
[04:25] 擁有新加坡IP地址的人，他從未讀過我的部落格，就會出現
[04:27] 從未讀過我的部落格，就會出現，把我罵得狗血淋頭，我不喜歡那個
[04:29] 把我罵得狗血淋頭，我不喜歡新加坡機場，我聽說過，但我
[04:33] 新加坡機場，我聽說過，但我感覺地毯讓我感覺它像
[04:35] 感覺地毯讓我感覺它像拉斯維加斯賭場，而不是
[04:37] 一個拉斯維加斯賭場，而不是這個
[04:38] 這個偉大的國際機場，但我
[04:41] 偉大的國際機場，但我，我實際上
[04:42] 我實際上沒有乘坐過新加坡航空，我乘坐過
[04:44] 沒有乘坐過新加坡航空，我乘坐過多次勝安航空。
[04:46] 多次勝安航空，好的，並將其用於區域航班。
[04:49] 好的，並將其用於區域航班，呃，但我的意思是，我住在中國大陸
[04:52] 呃，但我的意思是，我住在中國大陸十年，而且
[04:53] 十年，而且新加坡航空總是更
[04:56] 新加坡航空總是更貴，從現金來看。
[04:57] 貴，從現金來看，而且比我想要的任何東西都更繞路。
[04:59] 而且比我想要的任何東西都更繞路，所以它是
[05:01] 想要的，所以真的只是當我，當我補充的時候。
[05:02] 真的只是當我，當我補充的時候，是勝安航空，它仍然完美地照顧著。
[05:04] 是勝安航空，它仍然完美地照顧著，它是一個
[05:05] 很好，這不是一個真正的預算體驗，我不知道該怎麼稱呼它，區域性的中檔，這完全沒問題，但是
[05:11] 我我沒有坐過主線，我一直很好奇，在我住的西雅圖，那個不停站的服務去年秋天開始了，我只是沒有說服我妻子在容易嘗試的時候嘗試它，所以我幫不了你。
[05:29] 我很好奇，嗯，我感覺多年前我喜歡西北航空的商務艙座位，那種超級超級私密的。
[05:41] 然後有一次我飛行時，我附近的一家人，母親很擔心，因為她無法看到她的孩子在做什麼，所以對她來說，這不是一個好的季節。
[05:50] 作為一個家庭，它是多麼的不同，然後我覺得像維珍航空，對孩子來說可能會很有趣。
[05:59] 所以從你女兒的角度來看，她嘗試過什麼產品，她真正讚不絕口的又是什麼？
[06:05] 嗯，嗯，我想她，她最喜歡的
[06:07] 嗯，我認為她最喜歡的兌換，嗯，或她曾經搭乘過最喜歡的航班，是搭乘阿提哈德航空的頭等艙，擁有自己的私人空間。
[06:14] 你知道，她從四個月大就開始飛行，而且飛行經驗相當豐富，她已經習慣了如何在特別是豪華艙內，如何表現。所以她非常獨立自主，而且非常喜歡商務艙座位提供的獨立性，以及頭等艙。所以她非常高興能在四萬英尺的高空洗澡，並且有管家照顧她。而且你知道，這在阿提哈德航空上真的很不錯。
[06:52] 我們在頭等艙裡有三位乘客，基本上有三位空服員為我們服務，整個飛行過程都是如此。所以她感覺自己像個公主，他們來陪她玩，和她一起度過時光，她真的很喜歡。
[07:07] 嗯，她真的很喜歡那次經歷，嗯，她也很喜歡Cafe First，而且你知道，她有很多經驗。
[07:13] 而且你知道，我認為其中一個，實際上，更有趣的經歷之一，是在Westjet，當時我們必須從卡爾加里飛往安大略省倫敦，而且
[07:25] 她和空服員交了朋友，然後幫忙處理了服務中的垃圾回收，所以她戴著Westjet的圍巾等等，然後告訴我她想成為一名空服員。
[07:40] 那時她還很小，然後Westjet很貼心地在我們回程的預訂上加了註記，然後把我們升等到北美商務艙，這很不錯，所以
[07:52] 嗯，我想她心裡一直對Westjet有份特別的情感，真的，我本來想插話說，因為我知道你在Westjet工作過一段時間，如果她養成了這些品味，那麼她可能不想要爸爸員工旅遊的待遇。
[08:08] 員工旅行，嗯，你知道，就像我說的，我們不介意
[08:10] 嗯，你知道，就像我說的，我們不太介意乘坐經濟艙
[08:12] 在北美乘坐經濟艙，因為你知道
[08:13] 在北美，因為你知道，通常你會看到的飛行時間最長的航班
[08:15] 通常從卡爾加里出發飛行時間最長的航班是，你知道
[08:18] 從卡爾加里出發是，你知道，六七八個小時，所以它是，它是，它是
[08:21] 六七八個小時，所以它是，它是，它是，它是可以接受的，它不是最好的
[08:23] 它是可以接受的，它不是最好的，顯然，但是
[08:24] 顯然，但是，嗯，你知道，我們曾乘坐直飛的隔夜航班
[08:26] 嗯，你知道，我們曾從卡爾加里直飛哈利法克斯的隔夜航班，嗯，那次
[08:29] 從卡爾加里到哈利法克斯，嗯，那次，那次很好，而且她足夠小
[08:31] 那次很好，而且她足夠小，所以，嗯，只要她能看到一些新東西，她其實不太在意
[08:33] 所以，嗯，只要她能看到一些新東西，她其實不太在意
[08:35] 所以，嗯，是的，她不介意飛行
[08:37] 所以，嗯，是的，她不介意乘坐 WestJet 航空，而且我們仍然進行相當多的
[08:39] 國內旅行，乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想
[08:40] 國內旅行，乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想如果
[08:42] 乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想如果你問她，她可能會更喜歡
[08:44] 你問她，她可能會更喜歡，嗯，當然是坐在高級客艙裡，嗯
[08:47] 嗯，當然是坐在高級客艙裡，嗯，那就是你提到的 WestJet 航空工會
[08:49] 那就是你提到的 WestJet 航空工會，讓我們來談談 WestJet 航空，我
[08:50] 讓我們來談談 WestJet 航空，我認為對於很多
[08:54] 認為它沒有出現在很多非加拿大旅客的雷達上，我，我意識到
[08:57] 非加拿大旅客，我，我住在紐約時意識到
[08:58] 我住在紐約時，達美航空與
[09:00] 達美航空發展了合作夥伴關係，在那裡我
[09:01] 他們，在那裡我出現在拉瓜迪亞機場的航班上，在
[09:03] 出現在拉瓜迪亞機場的航班上，在多倫多，而且
[09:05] 多倫多，而且，登機口的工作人員由
[09:07] 登機口的工作人員由穿著 T 恤和牛仔褲的孩子們擔任
[09:11] 我的達美航空班機在哪裡然後但是
[09:14] 我的達美航空班機在哪裡然後但是我上飛機了我是說
[09:15] 上飛機了我是說這是一個非常呃直接的
[09:17] 這是一個非常呃直接的體驗但是我喜歡那個小小的呃
[09:19] 體驗但是我喜歡那個小小的呃檸檬皮屑包裝紙隨附於
[09:21] 檸檬皮屑包裝紙隨附於班機然後
[09:23] 班機然後快速飛越這就是
[09:25] 快速飛越這就是我認識了幾年的
[09:26] 我認識了幾年的是的是的我是說我在Westjet工作過
[09:30] 是的是的我是說我在Westjet工作過嗯
[09:31] 嗯在忠誠度部門嗯作為
[09:33] 在忠誠度部門嗯作為最終作為高級
[09:35] 最終作為忠誠度的代理高級經理
[09:37] 忠誠度的代理高級經理呃在一段時間內我領導了一個團隊
[09:40] 呃在一段時間內我領導了一個由六名分析師和
[09:42] 六名分析師和營銷人員
[09:44] 營銷人員他們專注於忠誠度
[09:46] 他們專注於忠誠度計劃和
[09:47] 計劃並試圖從中提取盡可能多的價值呃
[09:50] 試圖從中提取盡可能多的價值呃從我們的
[09:51] 我們的我們的頂級會員盡可能多所以
[09:53] 這意味著促銷和
[09:54] 這意味著促銷和和真正理解深入的
[09:57] 和真正理解呃人們如何行為的深入分析
[09:59] 呃人們如何行為的分析在嗯作為作為一個的頂級會員
[10:02] 在嗯作為作為一個忠誠度計劃的頂級會員
[10:03] 忠誠度計劃並試圖真正理解它如何
[10:07] 並試圖真正理解它是或
[10:07] 是或你知道什麼讓人們繼續飛行
[10:09] 你知道什麼讓他們飛行呃他們重視什麼
[10:11] 嗯，他們重視這些東西什麼？顯然，每一個
[10:13] 這些東西顯然每個個體都是獨特的，但是
[10:15] 個體是獨特的，但總的來說，你有一種普遍的
[10:17] 總的來說，你有一種人們真正重視的普遍類別
[10:19] 人們真正重視的東西，嗯，而且這真的
[10:21] 非常有趣，能夠獲得這種見解
[10:24] 有趣，能夠獲得這種見解，嗯，然後也能夠與
[10:26] 嗯，然後也能夠與我們一些頂級的
[10:28] 嗯，單獨地與一些頂級會員
[10:29] 會員，嗯，而且真的驗證了我們
[10:31] 嗯，而且真的驗證了我們正在
[10:32] 從我們正在看到的數據中提取的
[10:34] 我們正在看到的數據中提取的
[10:36] 看到，哦，哇，所以透過一窺究竟
[10:38] 哦，哇，所以透過一窺究竟，而
[10:39] 頻繁飛行的旅客經常覺得這些
[10:42] 頻繁飛行的旅客經常覺得這些計畫是由根本不了解他們的人員組成的
[10:45] 根本不了解他們，或者是有意地，或者不是
[10:47] 有意地，或者不是，但你，你在某種意義上是我們中的一員
[10:48] 但你在某種意義上是我們中的一員
[10:53] 這種對旅行的興趣，嗯
[10:56] 這種對旅行的興趣，嗯，而且也許你的一些同事
[10:58] 而且也許你的一些同事並非來自，他們可能來自
[10:59] 並非來自，他們可能來自
[11:00] 比如說金融或市場行銷背景
[11:03] 比如說金融或市場行銷背景，來自不同的行業，什麼
[11:05] 來自不同的行業，你，你是如何溝通
[11:08] 你是如何溝通它的感覺的
[11:09] 它的感覺，我不知道你是否認為自己是個
[11:10] 我不知道你是否認為自己是個航空迷，但嗯，你知道
[11:12] 我是個航空迷，但你知道，那份對飛行的熱愛，你怎麼
[11:14] 那份對飛行的熱愛，你怎麼傳達給同事
[11:15] 傳達給那些只是要去
[11:17] 另一份公司工作的同事
[11:18] 另一份公司工作呢，嗯，我認為，一般來說，那些
[11:21] 嗯，我認為，一般來說，在航空公司工作的人
[11:22] 工作的人，往往也是航空迷，嗯
[11:25] 往往也是航空迷，嗯，你知道，當
[11:26] 你知道，當我們推出 787 的時候，嗯
[11:29] 當我們推出 787 的時候，嗯，你需要付給我們的清潔人員
[11:32] 你需要付給我們的清潔人員很多額外的錢，來清除所有
[11:34] 大量的額外金錢，來清除窗戶上所有臉部留下的污漬，因為人們
[11:35] 臉部留下的污漬，因為人們正在看著飛機第一次在停機坪上滑行的樣子
[11:38] 人們正在看著飛機第一次在停機坪上滑行的樣子，嗯
[11:40] 第一次在停機坪上滑行，嗯，所以
[11:41] 所以，你知道，我認為，一般來說，每個人
[11:43] 你知道，我認為，一般來說，在 WestJet 工作的所有人
[11:45] 在 WestJet 工作的人，嗯，籠統地說，顯然，但我認為
[11:47] 嗯，籠統地說，顯然，但我認為每個人都是航空和
[11:49] 航空和飛機的忠實粉絲，嗯，但你知道
[11:53] 航空和飛機的忠實粉絲，嗯，但你知道，回到你關於
[11:57] 回到你關於，你知道，我們怎麼
[12:00] 你知道，我們怎麼傳達我們的一些熱情
[12:02] 傳達我們的一些熱情，作為忠誠度
[12:03] 忠誠度愛好者，在一個忠誠度計畫中，而且
[12:06] 忠誠度計畫中的愛好者，而且在這個計畫中工作的人
[12:09] 在這個計畫中工作的人，是否也有同樣的背景，而且你
[12:11] 有同樣的背景，而且你知道，坦白說
[12:13] 坦白說，答案並不是一個真正的
[12:15] 不幸的是，答案並不是一個真正的積極的，因為
[12:16] 積極的，因為很多那些人傾向於來自
[12:19] 很多那些人傾向於來自 WestJet 的不同部門，而且有點
[12:21] 來自 WestJet 的不同部門，而且有點
[12:22] 你知道，對忠誠度來說是新的，我的意思是他們
[12:24] 你知道，對忠誠度來說是新的，我的意思是他們他們在我
[12:25] 在我離開時，我想有
[12:28] 在我離開時，我想有
[12:29] 有兩個人，據我所知
[12:31] 有兩個人，據我所知，他們引進了
[12:33] 他們引進了，他們有一些忠誠度的背景
[12:35] 他們有一些忠誠度的背景，其中一人曾在 Avios 工作
[12:37] 其中一人曾在 Avios 工作，另一位是該部門的主管
[12:38] 另一位是該部門的主管
[12:40] 該部門曾任職於 Emirates，所以他有
[12:42] 曾任職於 Emirates，所以他有一些背景
[12:43] 一些背景，他也曾在 Collison 工作，所以
[12:45] 他也曾在 Collison 工作，所以了解休息室方面的事情
[12:47] 了解休息室方面的事情，所以與...交談真的很有趣
[12:49] 所以與他們交談並聽取他們的觀點真的很有趣
[12:50] 聽取他們對事情的觀點
[12:51] 事情，但該團隊中的其他人
[12:54] 但該團隊中的其他人傾向於來自其他方面
[12:56] 傾向於來自其他方面，而負責該團隊的副總裁
[12:59] 副總裁實際上來自供應鏈，並且
[13:02] 實際上來自供應鏈，所以
[13:03] 所以有點
[13:06] 有點挑戰
[13:06] 讓人們理解...價值的挑戰
[13:08] 讓人們理解忠誠度的價值以及我們試圖做的一些事情
[13:10] 忠誠度以及我們試圖做的一些事情
[13:12] 我們試圖做的事情通常很困難
[13:14] 經常都很困難，因為我們不僅需要說服 WestJet 內部的其他部門，讓他們相信我們的想法是有效的並且能帶來價值，而且我們還必須，你知道，採取第一步來解釋它，並讓忠誠度團隊中的人們也能理解。
[13:30] 所以，你知道，如果你必須解釋一下，總會有些資訊在翻譯中丟失。
[13:38] 所以當他們，你知道，試圖向上推銷我們的想法時，他們沒有同樣程度的理解，或者可能沒有我們試圖完成的熱情。
[13:49] 所以它經常，我經常發現很令人沮喪，試圖把事情做好。
[13:53] 嗯，你知道，有人，我實際上負責常旅客計劃，呃，呃，兌換合作夥伴，以及我們自己的忠誠度計劃，呃，它叫做會員專享，它是，呃，WestJet 的獎勵庫存。
[14:11] 而我當時正在嘗試做一些有趣的事情。
[14:15] 我試圖做嗯，但我們經常與收入部門意見不合
[14:18] 但我們經常與收入管理部門意見不合
[14:19] 管理部門，嗯，他們在航空公司的職責是
[14:22] 嗯，他們的職責是在航空公司賺錢
[14:23] 賺錢，嗯，你可以想像，嗯，當我在的時候
[14:26] 嗯，而且你可以想像，嗯，當我在那裡的時候，Westjet 是一家上市公司
[14:27] 那裡 Westjet 是一家上市公司
[14:28] 公司，所以這些人總是感興趣
[14:31] 所以這些人總是感興趣
[14:32] 他們的季度業績看起來如何
[14:34] 他們的季度業績看起來如何，嗯，所以要獲得
[14:35] 嗯，所以要引起他們的注意，試圖
[14:39] 引起他們的注意，試圖提出並發展一個長期的
[14:43] 提出並發展一個需要一些時間來實施的長期想法
[14:45] 想法，該想法需要一些時間來實施並產生價值
[14:47] 實施並產生價值，這通常是一個非常艱鉅的挑戰
[14:52] 是的，當我，我不知道多少
[14:53] 是的，當我，我不知道這個計劃有多少
[14:55] 這個計劃看起來和你當時的一樣
[14:58] 看起來和你當時的一樣，嗯，但當我，當我瀏覽
[15:01] 嗯，但當我，當我瀏覽目前的福利時，什麼最讓我
[15:02] 目前的福利，什麼最讓我對美國的一些計劃更熟悉
[15:05] 計劃是你有黃金會員，它
[15:09] 一年六次獲得預選座位
[15:11] 選擇，但仍然可以無限制地進入貴賓室
[15:12] 但仍然可以為旅客和直系親屬提供無限貴賓室使用權，以及
[15:16] 旅客及隨行家人和貴賓券。
[15:17] 貴賓券，嗯，在我看來，這是一個美國的計畫，完全顛倒了，在那裡。
[15:21] 計畫完全顛倒了，在那裡他們會發放各種座位選擇。
[15:25] 選擇，但貴賓室的通行權卻非常難獲得，我很好奇。
[15:30] 難以獲得，我很好奇，這會導向何方，我甚至，我猜我不知道WestJet貴賓室的體驗，說實話，我用過一些Priority Pass的第三方貴賓室，在搭乘WestJet時。
[15:38] 是的，所以WestJet目前沒有自己的貴賓室，它們都是第三方，而且很大程度上是你透過Priority Pass體驗到的相同貴賓室。
[15:50] 然而，卡加利的旗艦貴賓室正在建設中，我沒有時間表，不知道它 supposed to 什麼時候開放，但我相信它 supposed to 在今年晚些時候。
[15:56] 開放，但我相信它 supposed to 在今年晚些時候，我記得上次聽說是十月，旗艦貴賓室實際上是一個非常有趣的價值主張。
[16:04] 嗯，旗艦貴賓室實際上是一個非常有趣的價值主張，West side 與卡加利機場管理局合作非常密切，因為它總部位於卡加利，所以他們有非常牢固的關係，而機場管理局甚至走得這麼遠。
[16:18] 嗯，機場管理局甚至還將主要的安檢點移開。
[16:22] 將主要的安檢點從一個不同的登機口移到這個新貴賓室前面的一個登機口。
[16:27] 就在這個新貴賓室前面，有點像是如果你進不去，當你通過安檢時，會有一種令人羨慕的感覺。
[16:35] 嗯，所以這個計劃晚點開放，但有趣的是，數位部門的負責人，他的名字叫阿爾弗雷多·譚，他其實來自臉書。
[16:44] 他在矽谷有很多聯繫，他們舉辦了他們所謂的第一次黑客松，為 Westjet 貴賓室，他們引進了像 Salesforce、IBM、Apple、臉書等所有這些大公司，基本上是舉辦一個案例競賽，想出如何開發一個以科技為主的貴賓室的點子。
[17:10] 基於此，我沒有他們最終結果的所有細節，因為預算一直是個問題，但他們正在看一些非常有趣的事情，像是你知道，如果
[17:19] 非常有趣的事情，你知道，如果一架飛機起飛
[17:20] 一架飛機起飛，呃，你可以透過它看到
[17:22] 呃，你可以透過窗戶看到它，呃，是的，其中一個想法是
[17:24] 窗戶，呃，是的，其中一個想法是擁有
[17:25] 擁有某種標記軌道，呃，在那裡
[17:27] 某種標記軌道，呃，那架飛機將飛往何處，以及
[17:28] 飛機將飛往何處，並關心飛行等事項
[17:30] 關心飛行等事項，非常互動
[17:32] 非常互動，呃，但你知道，隨著所有
[17:34] 呃，但你知道，隨著 covid 發生的一切變化，我
[17:36] covid 發生的一切變化，我不知道實際上會是什麼
[17:37] 不知道實際上會是什麼在那個貴賓室裡
[17:38] 在那個貴賓室裡，嗯，但你知道，就而言
[17:42] 嗯，但你知道，就為什麼他們設立了無限貴賓室而言
[17:45] 為什麼他們設立了無限貴賓室，我提到了一個事實，嗯，你知道
[17:48] 我提到了一個事實，嗯，你知道，了解什麼對我們的頂級會員有價值
[17:51] 了解什麼對我們的頂級會員有價值
[17:52] 級會員，呃，你知道他們經常旅行
[17:54] 呃，你知道他們經常旅行
[17:55] 為了工作，而且很多時候，你知道
[17:58] 為了工作，而且很多時候，你知道他們獲得了所有這些附加服務的支付
[18:00] 他們獲得了所有這些附加服務的支付，由他們的工作支付，所以你知道他們
[18:02] 由他們的工作支付，所以你知道他們看到選擇，他們得到免費行李，所有那些
[18:04] 看到選擇，他們得到免費行李，所有這些東西都是
[18:05] 東西就是，對他們來說什麼都不是，對吧，所以
[18:08] 就是，對他們來說什麼都不是，對吧，所以什麼對他們來說真正重要，嗯，我
[18:10] 什麼對他們來說真正重要，嗯，我認為你可能聽過這個
[18:11] 你可能聽過很多次，那就是作為一個經常出差的商務人士
[18:14] 很多次，那就是作為一個經常出差的商務人士，因為你離開了
[18:15] 因為你離開家這麼久，所以當你
[18:17] 離開家這麼久，所以當你真的帶家人去度假時
[18:19] 真的帶家人去度假，呃，你想在家人面前炫耀
[18:21] 嗯，你想向家人炫耀，嘿，看，這就是
[18:23] 嘿，看，這就是你知道我不在家能為我們家帶來的
[18:25] 你知道我不在家能為我們家在旅行時帶來的
[18:26] 家人在旅行時，這就是為什麼他們允許無限次
[18:30] 這就是為什麼他們允許無限次進入貴賓室
[18:31] 會員以及家庭成員都可以進入貴賓室
[18:33] 會員以及家庭成員，所以這有點獨特
[18:35] 所以這有點獨特，你很少見到這樣的服務
[18:37] 你很少在貴賓室見到的服務，而且
[18:38] 在貴賓室，而且你可以有一個非常大的家庭
[18:40] 你可以有一個非常大的家庭團體，我認為最多可以有八個人
[18:42] 團體，我認為最多可以有八個人，嗯，家庭，所以你知道，這總是
[18:45] 嗯，家庭，所以你知道，這總是很好，你知道，作為
[18:46] 總是很好，你知道，作為一個旅行者，當我和我的妻子一起旅行時
[18:48] 作為一個旅行者，當我和我的妻子及女兒一起旅行時，沒有什麼比這更讓我惱火的了
[18:51] 和女兒，沒有什麼比這更讓我惱火的了
[18:51] 比嗯，進入一個貴賓室，呃，像一個
[18:53] 嗯，進入一個貴賓室，呃，像一個優先通行證貴賓室，在那裡
[18:55] 優先通行證貴賓室，你知道，我有兩個人的通行權，但是
[18:57] 你知道，我有兩個人的通行權，但是我的女兒，你知道，她幾乎不吃東西
[18:59] 我的女兒，你知道，她幾乎不吃東西，只是需要和我們在一起
[19:00] 只是需要和我們在一起，卻要收27美元，對吧，這
[19:03] 卻要收27美元，這真的讓我很惱火
[19:05] 這真的讓我很惱火，所以你知道，我可以想像，你知道
[19:06] 所以你知道，我可以想像，你知道，作為一個常旅客
[19:08] 作為一個常旅客，如果你是為了度假而旅行
[19:10] 如果你是為了度假而和家人一起旅行，而且
[19:11] 和家人在一起，卻在門口被告知你只能
[19:13] 在門口被告知你只能帶一個人進去
[19:15] 只能帶一個人進去，嗯，這可能會很煩人，嗯
[19:18] 嗯，這可能會很煩人，嗯，你知道，從經濟上來說，這很有趣
[19:21] 你知道，從經濟上來說，這很有趣，嗯
[19:21] 嗯，這是一個有趣的策略，因為讓人們待在貴賓室可能相當昂貴，所以嗯，是的，看看他們是否會取消這項福利，還是很有趣的。
[19:32] 是的，還有旗艦貴賓室，當我聽到這樣的話時，聽起來不像他們想成為一家廉價航空公司，聽起來他們正在加緊努力，爭奪加拿大航空的市場，嗯，是的，這就是意圖。
[19:44] 嗯，現在我想挑戰在於，你知道，加拿大航空是現任者，他們非常了解他們的頂級會員，而且你知道，貴賓室一直以來都很好，他們的 Signature Series 貴賓室在溫哥華和多倫多的出現，讓成為加拿大航空的頂級會員更具吸引力。
[20:09] 嗯，但是當我轉到 WestJet 時，我這樣做的原因之一是 787 的推出，以及他們實際上將推出與加拿大航空相當，甚至在某些方面更好的商務艙的想法。

Full Transcript (Bilingual)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ly-z8aXk9TY
Translation: zh-TW

[00:12] i love canada i love talking about canada so we welcome the canadian guest j slow of points nerd
我愛加拿大，我愛談論加拿大，所以我們歡迎加拿大貴賓 J. Slow of Points Nerd。

[00:20] the canadian guest j slow of points nerd hi stefan thanks for having me well you
加拿大貴賓 J. Slow of Points Nerd，嗨 Stefan，謝謝你的邀請，嗯，你...

[00:23] hi stefan thanks for having me well you thank you for making time you've just taken on a
嗨 Stefan，謝謝你的邀請，嗯，你，謝謝你抽空前來，你剛剛接任了一個

[00:25] taken on a a big new job and uh curious about all of that but uh by the profile picture you're showing it looks like you are a family traveler
一個新的大工作，嗯，對這一切都很好奇，但是，嗯，從你展示的個人資料照片來看，你似乎是一位家庭旅行者

[00:35] and a rogue warrior so tell tell us what your travel profile is
和一位浪人戰士，所以請告訴我們你的旅行檔案是什麼。

[00:39] uh yeah i mean typically um you know we we travel you know one or two times per year for big big trips um typically i'd like to take uh a month off and take a full trip
嗯，是的，我的意思是，通常，嗯，你知道，我們每年會進行一到兩次大型旅行，通常我喜歡休一個月假，然後進行一次完整的旅行，

[00:53] and usually that means hitting as many continents as possible and as many new countries as possible uh you know we're trying to do uh what you do and then try to hit all the countries
通常這意味著盡可能多地去到各大洲，盡可能多地去到新的國家，你知道，我們正試圖做你所做的事情，然後試圖去到所有國家。

[01:02] and then try to hit all the countries but um i've got a goal of hitting 100
然後試圖去到所有國家，但我有一個目標是去到100個國家

[01:05] but um i've got a goal of hitting 100 countries for my daughter by the time
但我有一個目標是為我的女兒在她滿18歲前去到100個國家

[01:06] countries for my daughter by the time she turns 18 and she's
為我的女兒在她滿18歲前去到100個國家，而她現在

[01:07] she turns 18 and she's 11 now in about about 42 countries so
她現在11歲，已經去了大約42個國家，所以

[01:11] 11 now in about about 42 countries so doing okay but uh you know it might be a
11歲了，去了大約42個國家，所以進展還可以，但你知道這可能有點

[01:13] doing okay but uh you know it might be a bit of a stretch to get to 100 but we're
進展還可以，但你知道要達到100個可能有點勉強，但我們正在努力

[01:14] bit of a stretch to get to 100 but we're trying
有點勉強要達到100個，但我們正在努力

[01:15] trying um so you know typically uh my wife and
努力，所以你知道通常我的妻子和我

[01:18] um so you know typically uh my wife and i
所以你知道通常我的妻子和我

[01:19] i uh travel with our daughter um and we
我會和我們的女兒一起旅行，我們

[01:21] uh travel with our daughter um and we like to travel
會和我們的女兒一起旅行，我們喜歡旅行

[01:22] like to travel in business class but we're not uh
喜歡坐商務艙旅行，但我們並不

[01:25] in business class but we're not uh we're not too good to fly economy on
坐商務艙，但我們並不介意偶爾乘坐經濟艙

[01:27] we're not too good to fly economy on occasion so typically on
偶爾乘坐經濟艙，所以通常在

[01:29] occasion so typically on uh domestic and trans border flights
偶爾，所以通常在國內和跨國航班上

[01:32] uh domestic and trans border flights we're typically flying uh
國內和跨國航班上，我們通常會乘坐

[01:34] we're typically flying uh uh on economy uh just because i can't uh
經濟艙，因為我無法

[01:36] uh on economy uh just because i can't uh i can't fathom the
經濟艙，因為我無法想像

[01:38] i can't fathom the the price difference as an asian uh to
作為亞洲人，我無法想像要為二等商務艙支付雙倍的價格差異

[01:40] the price difference as an asian uh to pay double for
要為二等商務艙支付雙倍的價格差異

[01:41] pay double for substandard business class so um you
支付雙倍的價格給二等商務艙，所以

[01:44] substandard business class so um you know that's that's typically what we do
二等商務艙，所以你知道這就是我們通常的做法

[01:46] know that's that's typically what we do for family travel and then for me for
你知道這就是我們通常的家庭旅行方式，然後對我來說，為了

[01:48] for family travel and then for me for business
家庭旅行，然後對我來說，為了商務

[01:48] business uh you know i i do take a decent amount
商務，你知道我確實會出差不少

[01:51] uh you know i i do take a decent amount of trips
你知道我確實會出差不少

[01:52] of trips um uh with my new job i am expecting
出差，我的新工作我預計

[01:55] um uh with my new job i am expecting that i'm going to be doing a lot more
我的新工作我預計我會做更多的

[01:56] that i'm going to be doing a lot more travel
更多的旅行

[01:56] travel uh as the uh coveted crisis uh
旅行，因為那個受人覬覦的危機

[02:00] uh as the uh coveted crisis uh uh updates but uh until then i'm kind of
受人覬覦的危機的更新，但在此之前，我有點

[02:02] uh updates but uh until then i'm kind of stuck at home working from home
嗯更新，但嗯，在此之前我有點被困在家裡，在家工作

[02:04] stuck at home working from home uh and itching to travel like i'm sure
被困在家裡，在家工作，嗯，渴望旅行，就像我確定一樣

[02:06] uh and itching to travel like i'm sure many of you and your your listeners are
嗯，渴望旅行，就像我確定你們很多人和你們的聽眾一樣

[02:09] many of you and your your listeners are are itching to do as well fantastic
你們很多人和你們的聽眾都渴望做同樣的事情，太棒了

[02:12] are itching to do as well fantastic and uh so that's three and that's one
渴望做同樣的事情，太棒了，嗯，那就是三個，那就是一個

[02:14] and uh so that's three and that's one more person that makes it
嗯，那就是三個，那就是又一個人，這使得

[02:16] more person that makes it easy generally from what easy points
更多的人，這使得它很容易，總的來說，從什麼容易積分

[02:19] easy generally from what easy points travel absolutely
很容易，總的來說，從什麼容易積分旅行，絕對

[02:21] travel absolutely yeah we were looking at so we're
旅行，絕對，是的，我們正在看，所以我們

[02:23] yeah we were looking at so we're planning on going to japan
是的，我們正在看，所以我們計劃去日本

[02:24] planning on going to japan uh in march and uh we've routed
計劃去日本，嗯，在三月，嗯，我們已經規劃了

[02:27] uh in march and uh we've routed um in japan airlines first class
嗯，在三月，嗯，我們已經規劃了，嗯，日本航空頭等艙

[02:32] um in japan airlines first class um over to tokyo and then down to
嗯，日本航空頭等艙，嗯，飛往東京，然後到

[02:34] um over to tokyo and then down to singapore
嗯，飛往東京，然後到新加坡

[02:36] singapore um coming back from singapore where
新加坡，嗯，從新加坡回來，在那裡

[02:38] um coming back from singapore where we're flying singapore
嗯，從新加坡回來，在那裡我們正在乘坐新加坡航空

[02:39] we're flying singapore business class but to be quite honest
我們正在乘坐新加坡航空商務艙，但老實說

[02:41] business class but to be quite honest i'm thinking of changing that because it
商務艙，但老實說，我正在考慮更改，因為它

[02:43] i'm thinking of changing that because it doesn't look all that appealing to be
我正在考慮更改，因為它看起來並不那麼吸引人

[02:45] doesn't look all that appealing to be frank and we're
坦率地說，看起來並不那麼吸引人，我們

[02:46] frank and we're looking at potentially using some of the
坦率地說，我們正在考慮可能使用一些

[02:49] looking at potentially using some of the alaska miles i have
考慮可能使用我的一些阿拉斯加里程

[02:51] alaska miles i have and flying emirates first uh throughout
我擁有的阿拉斯加里程，並乘坐阿聯酋航空頭等艙，嗯，全程

[02:54] and flying emirates first uh throughout through dubai but um yeah
並乘坐阿聯酋航空頭等艙，嗯，全程經杜拜，但嗯，是的

[02:57] through dubai but um yeah easy to find two harder hard to find
經杜拜，但嗯，是的，容易找到兩個，難找

[02:59] easy to find two harder hard to find three
容易找到兩個，難找三個

[03:02] and what's not appealing about the the
關於那個那個，什麼不吸引人

[03:04] and what's not appealing about the the singapore option you're seeing is it the singapore option you're seeing is it the well you know
而新加坡選項不吸引人的地方是，你看到的，你看到的，嗯，你知道

[03:08] well you know when i end up searching for uh reward flights i often do a lot of
嗯，你知道，當我最終搜尋獎勵機票時，我經常做很多

[03:11] when i end up searching for uh reward flights i often do a lot of due diligence through youtube and uh
當我最終搜尋獎勵機票時，我經常透過 YouTube 做很多盡職調查，還有

[03:12] flights i often do a lot of due diligence through youtube and uh watch a lot of youtube videos on
機票，我經常透過 YouTube 做很多盡職調查，還有看很多關於

[03:14] due diligence through youtube and uh watch a lot of youtube videos on uh the the quality of the product and
盡職調查，還有看很多關於產品品質的 YouTube 影片，還有

[03:16] watch a lot of youtube videos on uh the the quality of the product and both soft and hard
看很多關於產品品質的 YouTube 影片，還有軟硬體方面

[03:18] uh the the quality of the product and both soft and hard and you know to be honest uh it just
嗯，產品的品質，還有軟硬體方面，而且說實話，它就是

[03:20] both soft and hard and you know to be honest uh it just doesn't look that appealing um and the stories
軟硬體方面，而且說實話，它就是看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的那些故事

[03:23] and you know to be honest uh it just doesn't look that appealing um and the stories i've read on the people taking
而且你知道說實話，它就是看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的那些故事

[03:23] doesn't look that appealing um and the stories i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore
看起來不那麼吸引人，嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡出發的航班

[03:25] um and the stories i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um
嗯，還有我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯

[03:28] i've read on the people taking uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard
我讀到的關於人們搭乘的，嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情

[03:29] uh you know the flights from singapore to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant
嗯，你知道，從新加坡飛往 EWR 的航班，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫

[03:31] to ewr um not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew
飛往 EWR，嗯，不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了

[03:34] not not the greatest things i've heard um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on
不是，不是我聽說過最棒的事情，嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘

[03:36] um so i'm a little hesitant and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred
嗯，所以我有點猶豫，事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬

[03:39] and the fact is that you know i we flew or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each
事實是，你知道，我，我們飛了，或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人

[03:40] or we're flying on alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each um so it's it's really not that
或者我們正在搭乘阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼

[03:42] alaska redemption and it's a hundred thousand points each um so it's it's really not that appealing when you consider that uh
阿拉斯加航空的獎勵機票，而且它是十萬點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼吸引人，當你考慮到

[03:43] thousand points each um so it's it's really not that appealing when you consider that uh cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000.
點數每人，嗯，所以它，它真的不是那麼吸引人，當你考慮到，嗯，咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。

[03:46] appealing when you consider that uh cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000. um so you know singapore was kind of
吸引人，當你考慮到，嗯，咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點

[03:48] cafe first is 80 000 or 70 000. um so you know singapore was kind of um we had sat in the seats when we were
咖啡第一航空是八萬或七萬點。嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點，嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在

[03:52] um so you know singapore was kind of um we had sat in the seats when we were out in cape town and in one of the malls out
嗯，所以你知道，新加坡有點，嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候

[03:55] um we had sat in the seats when we were out in cape town and in one of the malls out there and saw that
嗯，我們曾在座位上坐過，當我們在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了

[03:58] out in cape town and in one of the malls out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
在開普敦，在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是

[03:59] and in one of the malls out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
在其中一個購物中心的時候，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是

[04:01] out there and saw that the wide business class seat and always
在那裡，看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是

[04:03] and saw that the wide business class seat and always
看到了寬敞的商務艙座位，而且總是

[04:05] the wide business class seat and always wanted to try it but.
寬敞的商務艙座位，我一直想嘗試，但是。

[04:06] wanted to try it but um now i'm having some reservations but.
想嘗試，但是嗯，現在我有些保留，但是。

[04:09] um now i'm having some reservations but i don't know if you've flown it before.
嗯，現在我有些保留，但我不知道你是否乘坐過，

[04:10] i don't know if you've flown it before and have any opinion but i'd be.
我不知道你是否乘坐過，是否有任何意見，但我會

[04:13] and have any opinion but i'd be interested to hear your opinion on that.
有任何意見，但我很想聽聽你對此的看法。

[04:16] interested to hear your opinion on that i've learned that in blogging if i say.
想聽聽你對此的看法，我在寫部落格時學到，如果我說

[04:18] i've learned that in blogging if i say even the slightest.
我在寫部落格時學到，如果我說，即使是絲毫的

[04:20] even the slightest critical thing about singapore someone.
對新加坡的批評，有人

[04:23] critical thing about singapore someone with a singapore ip address who has.
對新加坡的批評，有人，擁有新加坡IP地址的人，他

[04:25] with a singapore ip address who has never read my blog will appear.
擁有新加坡IP地址的人，他從未讀過我的部落格，就會出現

[04:27] never read my blog will appear and rip me to shreds i do not like the.
從未讀過我的部落格，就會出現，把我罵得狗血淋頭，我不喜歡那個

[04:29] and rip me to shreds i do not like the singapore airport and i hear it but i.
把我罵得狗血淋頭，我不喜歡新加坡機場，我聽說過，但我

[04:33] singapore airport and i hear it but i feel like carpet makes me feel like it's.
新加坡機場，我聽說過，但我感覺地毯讓我感覺它像

[04:35] feel like carpet makes me feel like it's an offstring vegas casino rather than.
感覺地毯讓我感覺它像拉斯維加斯賭場，而不是

[04:37] an offstring vegas casino rather than this.
一個拉斯維加斯賭場，而不是這個

[04:38] this great international airport but i've.
這個偉大的國際機場，但我

[04:41] great international airport but i've i've actually.
偉大的國際機場，但我，我實際上

[04:42] i've actually not flown mainline singapore i've flown.
我實際上沒有乘坐過新加坡航空，我乘坐過

[04:44] not flown mainline singapore i've flown silk air several times.
沒有乘坐過新加坡航空，我乘坐過多次勝安航空。

[04:46] silk air several times okay and use it for regional flights.
多次勝安航空，好的，並將其用於區域航班。

[04:49] okay and use it for regional flights uh but i mean i lived in mainland china.
好的，並將其用於區域航班，呃，但我的意思是，我住在中國大陸

[04:52] uh but i mean i lived in mainland china for a decade and.
呃，但我的意思是，我住在中國大陸十年，而且

[04:53] for a decade and singapore airlines was always more.
十年，而且新加坡航空總是更

[04:56] singapore airlines was always more pricey cash wise.
新加坡航空總是更貴，從現金來看。

[04:57] pricey cash wise and more out of the way than anything i.
貴，從現金來看，而且比我想要的任何東西都更繞路。

[04:59] and more out of the way than anything i wanted so it was.
而且比我想要的任何東西都更繞路，所以它是

[05:01] wanted so it was really just when i when i supplemented.
想要的，所以真的只是當我，當我補充的時候。

[05:02] really just when i when i supplemented was was silk which still cares perfectly.
真的只是當我，當我補充的時候，是勝安航空，它仍然完美地照顧著。

[05:04] was was silk which still cares perfectly fine it's a
是勝安航空，它仍然完美地照顧著，它是一個

[05:05] fine it's a not really a budget experience i don't know what to call it regional mid-range and that's perfectly fine but
很好，這不是一個真正的預算體驗，我不知道該怎麼稱呼它，區域性的中檔，這完全沒問題，但是

[05:11] i've i've not been on mainline i've been curious where i live in seattle that non-stop service started last fall and i just didn't convince my wife to try it when it was easy to try it so i can't i can't help you there
我我沒有坐過主線，我一直很好奇，在我住的西雅圖，那個不停站的服務去年秋天開始了，我只是沒有說服我妻子在容易嘗試的時候嘗試它，所以我幫不了你。

[05:29] i'm curious uh i felt like years ago i loved the northwest uh business class seat which was like ultra ultra private
我很好奇，嗯，我感覺多年前我喜歡西北航空的商務艙座位，那種超級超級私密的。

[05:41] and then one time i was flying and a family near me the mother was worried because she had no visibility to what her kids were doing and so for her it wasn't a good season
然後有一次我飛行時，我附近的一家人，母親很擔心，因為她無法看到她的孩子在做什麼，所以對她來說，這不是一個好的季節。

[05:50] and how different it is as a family and then i feel like say like virgin atlantic would probably be really fun for a kid
作為一個家庭，它是多麼的不同，然後我覺得像維珍航空，對孩子來說可能會很有趣。

[05:59] so through your daughter's eyes what what product has she tried and what is she really raved about
所以從你女兒的角度來看，她嘗試過什麼產品，她真正讚不絕口的又是什麼？

[06:05] uh well i think her her favorite
嗯，嗯，我想她，她最喜歡的

[06:07] Uh well I think her her favorite redemption redemption um or or favorite flight that she's ever um or or favorite flight that she's ever taken was taken was having her own apartment on Etihad first having her own apartment on Etihad first class class.
嗯，我認為她最喜歡的兌換，嗯，或她曾經搭乘過最喜歡的航班，是搭乘阿提哈德航空的頭等艙，擁有自己的私人空間。

[06:14] Um you know she's she's flown since um you know she's she's flown since she's been four months old and quite she's been four months old and quite extensively uh extensively uh and she's she's kind of gotten used to and she's she's kind of gotten used to the idea of the idea of um how to behave on uh especially in um how to behave on uh especially in premium premium cabin and uh so she's premium premium cabin and uh so she's very self-sufficient and and just loves the independence that uh the just loves the independence that uh the the business class seat offers uh and the business class seat offers uh and um and first class and so you know she um and first class and so you know she was was she was incredibly happy to take a she was incredibly happy to take a shower at 40 000 feet shower at 40 000 feet and kind of have a butler you know take and kind of have a butler you know take care of her care of her and you know have you know it was really and you know have you know it was really nice on Etihad.
你知道，她從四個月大就開始飛行，而且飛行經驗相當豐富，她已經習慣了如何在特別是豪華艙內，如何表現。所以她非常獨立自主，而且非常喜歡商務艙座位提供的獨立性，以及頭等艙。所以她非常高興能在四萬英尺的高空洗澡，並且有管家照顧她。而且你知道，這在阿提哈德航空上真的很不錯。

[06:52] We had um three people in the cabin first class cabin um and and basically three crew members um and and basically three crew members uh servicing us uh uh servicing us uh the entire flight so you know she was made to feel like a princess they came and played with her and hung out with and played with her and hung out with her um and and she really loved that.
我們在頭等艙裡有三位乘客，基本上有三位空服員為我們服務，整個飛行過程都是如此。所以她感覺自己像個公主，他們來陪她玩，和她一起度過時光，她真的很喜歡。

[07:07] um and and she really loved that experience um she also loved cafe first as well uh and you know she's she's had a lot of experience
嗯，她真的很喜歡那次經歷，嗯，她也很喜歡Cafe First，而且你知道，她有很多經驗。

[07:13] and and you know i think one of the actually one of the more more interesting experiences uh was on westjet uh when we had to fly out to london ontario uh from calgary and uh
而且你知道，我認為其中一個，實際上，更有趣的經歷之一，是在Westjet，當時我們必須從卡爾加里飛往安大略省倫敦，而且

[07:25] she made friends with the faa and uh helped uh uh with a uh garbage pickup uh in in service and uh so she wore the the westjet scarf and everything and then told me she wanted to be a flight attendant
她和空服員交了朋友，然後幫忙處理了服務中的垃圾回收，所以她戴著Westjet的圍巾等等，然後告訴我她想成為一名空服員。

[07:40] this was when she was very young and then um westjet was nice enough to actually put a note on our reservation on the return and uh bumped us up into the north american business class which was nice so
那時她還很小，然後Westjet很貼心地在我們回程的預訂上加了註記，然後把我們升等到北美商務艙，這很不錯，所以

[07:52] um i think she she's always had a soft spark in her heart for westjet as well really and i was going to jump in and say because i know you you worked for westjet for a period that if if she's developed these tastes then she probably doesn't want what daddy's employee travels
嗯，我想她心裡一直對Westjet有份特別的情感，真的，我本來想插話說，因為我知道你在Westjet工作過一段時間，如果她養成了這些品味，那麼她可能不想要爸爸員工旅遊的待遇。

[08:08] employee travels yeah you know like i said we don't mind
員工旅行，嗯，你知道，就像我說的，我們不介意

[08:10] yeah you know like i said we don't mind so much flying economy
嗯，你知道，就像我說的，我們不太介意乘坐經濟艙

[08:12] so much flying economy in north america because you know
在北美乘坐經濟艙，因為你知道

[08:13] in north america because you know typically the longest flight you'll see
在北美，因為你知道，通常你會看到的飛行時間最長的航班

[08:15] typically the longest flight you'll see from calgary is you know
通常從卡爾加里出發飛行時間最長的航班是，你知道

[08:18] from calgary is you know six seven eight hours so it's it's it's
從卡爾加里出發是，你知道，六七八個小時，所以它是，它是，它是

[08:21] six seven eight hours so it's it's it's it's passable it's it's not the greatest
六七八個小時，所以它是，它是，它是，它是可以接受的，它不是最好的

[08:23] it's passable it's it's not the greatest obviously but
它是可以接受的，它不是最好的，顯然，但是

[08:24] obviously but um you know we've flown overnight direct
顯然，但是，嗯，你知道，我們曾乘坐直飛的隔夜航班

[08:26] um you know we've flown overnight direct from calgary to halifax uh and that was
嗯，你知道，我們曾從卡爾加里直飛哈利法克斯的隔夜航班，嗯，那次

[08:29] from calgary to halifax uh and that was that was fine and she's small enough
從卡爾加里到哈利法克斯，嗯，那次，那次很好，而且她足夠小

[08:31] that was fine and she's small enough that uh she doesn't really care as long
那次很好，而且她足夠小，所以，嗯，只要她能看到一些新東西，她其實不太在意

[08:33] that uh she doesn't really care as long as she kind of gets to see something new
所以，嗯，只要她能看到一些新東西，她其實不太在意

[08:35] as she kind of gets to see something new so um yeah she she doesn't mind flying
所以，嗯，是的，她不介意飛行

[08:37] so um yeah she she doesn't mind flying west yet and we still do a decent amount
所以，嗯，是的，她不介意乘坐 WestJet 航空，而且我們仍然進行相當多的

[08:39] west yet and we still do a decent amount of domestic
國內旅行，乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想

[08:40] of domestic travel on westjet but uh i think that if
國內旅行，乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想如果

[08:42] travel on westjet but uh i think that if you asked or she would probably prefer
乘坐 WestJet 航空，但是，嗯，我想如果你問她，她可能會更喜歡

[08:44] you asked or she would probably prefer uh being in premium cabin for sure well
你問她，她可能會更喜歡，嗯，當然是坐在高級客艙裡，嗯

[08:47] uh being in premium cabin for sure well that's the union you brought up westjet
嗯，當然是坐在高級客艙裡，嗯，那就是你提到的 WestJet 航空工會

[08:49] that's the union you brought up westjet let's talk westjet i
那就是你提到的 WestJet 航空工會，讓我們來談談 WestJet 航空，我

[08:50] let's talk westjet i think it's not on the radar for a lot of
讓我們來談談 WestJet 航空，我認為對於很多

[08:54] think it's not on the radar for a lot of non-canadian travelers i i became aware
認為它沒有出現在很多非加拿大旅客的雷達上，我，我意識到

[08:57] non-canadian travelers i i became aware when i lived in new york
非加拿大旅客，我，我住在紐約時意識到

[08:58] when i lived in new york and delta developed a partnership with
我住在紐約時，達美航空與

[09:00] and delta developed a partnership with them where i
達美航空發展了合作夥伴關係，在那裡我

[09:01] them where i showed up for my flight in laguardia at
他們，在那裡我出現在拉瓜迪亞機場的航班上，在

[09:03] showed up for my flight in laguardia at the toronto and it
出現在拉瓜迪亞機場的航班上，在多倫多，而且

[09:05] the toronto and it the gate agents were being staffed by
多倫多，而且，登機口的工作人員由

[09:07] the gate agents were being staffed by like kids and t-shirts and jeans
登機口的工作人員由穿著 T 恤和牛仔褲的孩子們擔任

[09:11] where's my delta flight and then but i
我的達美航空班機在哪裡然後但是

[09:14] where's my delta flight and then but i got on board i mean
我的達美航空班機在哪裡然後但是我上飛機了我是說

[09:15] got on board i mean it's a very uh straightforward
上飛機了我是說這是一個非常呃直接的

[09:17] it's a very uh straightforward experience but i love the little uh
這是一個非常呃直接的體驗但是我喜歡那個小小的呃

[09:19] experience but i love the little uh lemon zest packets that come with the
體驗但是我喜歡那個小小的呃檸檬皮屑包裝紙隨附於

[09:21] lemon zest packets that come with the flight and then
檸檬皮屑包裝紙隨附於班機然後

[09:23] flight and then quick flight over and that's that's what
班機然後快速飛越這就是

[09:25] quick flight over and that's that's what i knew for a few years
快速飛越這就是我認識了幾年的

[09:26] i knew for a few years yeah yeah i mean i i worked at westjet
我認識了幾年的是的是的我是說我在Westjet工作過

[09:30] yeah yeah i mean i i worked at westjet um
是的是的我是說我在Westjet工作過嗯

[09:31] um in the loyalty department um as
嗯在忠誠度部門嗯作為

[09:33] in the loyalty department um as ultimately as the senior
在忠誠度部門嗯作為最終作為高級

[09:35] ultimately as the senior the interim senior manager for loyalty
最終作為忠誠度的代理高級經理

[09:37] the interim senior manager for loyalty uh for a period where i ran a team of
忠誠度的代理高級經理呃在一段時間內我領導了一個團隊

[09:40] uh for a period where i ran a team of six individuals of analysts and
呃在一段時間內我領導了一個由六名分析師和

[09:42] six individuals of analysts and marketers
六名分析師和營銷人員

[09:44] marketers that were concentrated on the loyalty
營銷人員他們專注於忠誠度

[09:46] that were concentrated on the loyalty program and
他們專注於忠誠度計劃和

[09:47] program and trying to extract as much value uh from
計劃並試圖從中提取盡可能多的價值呃

[09:50] trying to extract as much value uh from our
試圖從中提取盡可能多的價值呃從我們的

[09:51] our our top tier members as possible and so
我們的我們的頂級會員盡可能多所以

[09:53] that meant promotions and
這意味著促銷和

[09:54] that meant promotions and and really understanding the deep
這意味著促銷和和真正理解深入的

[09:57] and really understanding the deep analytics of uh how people behave
和真正理解呃人們如何行為的深入分析

[09:59] analytics of uh how people behave in um as as top tier members of a
呃人們如何行為的分析在嗯作為作為一個的頂級會員

[10:02] in um as as top tier members of a loyalty program
在嗯作為作為一個忠誠度計劃的頂級會員

[10:03] loyalty program and trying to really understand how it
忠誠度計劃並試圖真正理解它如何

[10:07] and trying to really understand how it is or
並試圖真正理解它是或

[10:07] is or you know what what keeps people flying
是或你知道什麼讓人們繼續飛行

[10:09] you know what what keeps people flying uh what do they value
你知道什麼讓他們飛行呃他們重視什麼

[10:11] uh what do they value those kinds of things obviously every
嗯，他們重視這些東西什麼？顯然，每一個

[10:13] those kinds of things obviously every individual's unique but
這些東西顯然每個個體都是獨特的，但是

[10:15] individual's unique but generally you have kind of a general
個體是獨特的，但總的來說，你有一種普遍的

[10:17] generally you have kind of a general bucket of what people
總的來說，你有一種人們真正重視的普遍類別

[10:19] bucket of what people really value uh and and it was really
人們真正重視的東西，嗯，而且這真的

[10:21] really value uh and and it was really interesting kind of getting that insight
非常有趣，能夠獲得這種見解

[10:24] interesting kind of getting that insight um and then also being able to to speak
有趣，能夠獲得這種見解，嗯，然後也能夠與

[10:26] um and then also being able to to speak uh individually with some of our top
嗯，然後也能夠與我們一些頂級的

[10:28] uh individually with some of our top tier members
嗯，單獨地與一些頂級會員

[10:29] tier members um and and really validating the what we
會員，嗯，而且真的驗證了我們

[10:31] um and and really validating the what we were
嗯，而且真的驗證了我們正在

[10:32] were extracting from the the data we were
從我們正在看到的數據中提取的

[10:34] extracting from the the data we were seeing
我們正在看到的數據中提取的

[10:36] seeing oh wow so with the the peak behind the
看到，哦，哇，所以透過一窺究竟

[10:38] oh wow so with the the peak behind the curtain and
哦，哇，所以透過一窺究竟，而

[10:39] curtain and frequent flyers often feel like these
頻繁飛行的旅客經常覺得這些

[10:42] frequent flyers often feel like these programs are staffed by people that just
頻繁飛行的旅客經常覺得這些計畫是由根本不了解他們的人員組成的

[10:45] programs are staffed by people that just don't get them right or or deliberate
根本不了解他們，或者是有意地，或者不是

[10:47] don't get them right or or deliberate deliberately or not
有意地，或者不是，但你，你在某種意義上是我們中的一員

[10:48] deliberately or not but you're you're one of us in the sense
但你在某種意義上是我們中的一員

[10:53] but you're you're one of us in the sense this interest in travel uh
這種對旅行的興趣，嗯

[10:56] this interest in travel uh and pr perhaps some of your colleagues
這種對旅行的興趣，嗯，而且也許你的一些同事

[10:58] and pr perhaps some of your colleagues didn't come from they might have come
而且也許你的一些同事並非來自，他們可能來自

[10:59] didn't come from they might have come from
並非來自，他們可能來自

[11:00] from say a finance or a marketing background
比如說金融或市場行銷背景

[11:03] say a finance or a marketing background from a different industry what
比如說金融或市場行銷背景，來自不同的行業，什麼

[11:05] from a different industry what what did you how did you communicate
來自不同的行業，你，你是如何溝通

[11:08] what did you how did you communicate what it's like
你是如何溝通它的感覺的

[11:09] what it's like i don't know if you consider yourself an
它的感覺，我不知道你是否認為自己是個

[11:10] i don't know if you consider yourself an av geek but uh you know
我不知道你是否認為自己是個航空迷，但嗯，你知道

[11:12] av geek but uh you know that that love for flying how did you
我是個航空迷，但你知道，那份對飛行的熱愛，你怎麼

[11:14] that that love for flying how did you communicate that
那份對飛行的熱愛，你怎麼傳達給同事

[11:15] communicate that to colleagues who are just just going to
傳達給那些只是要去

[11:17] to colleagues who are just just going to another corporate job
另一份公司工作的同事

[11:18] another corporate job well i think um in general people that
另一份公司工作呢，嗯，我認為，一般來說，那些

[11:21] well i think um in general people that work for airlines
嗯，我認為，一般來說，在航空公司工作的人

[11:22] work for airlines tend to be uh uh have geeks as well um
工作的人，往往也是航空迷，嗯

[11:25] tend to be uh uh have geeks as well um you know when
往往也是航空迷，嗯，你知道，當

[11:26] you know when when we launched the 787 um
你知道，當我們推出 787 的時候，嗯

[11:29] when we launched the 787 um you you you needed to pay our cleaners a
當我們推出 787 的時候，嗯，你需要付給我們的清潔人員

[11:32] you you you needed to pay our cleaners a lot of extra money to clear all the
你需要付給我們的清潔人員很多額外的錢，來清除所有

[11:34] lot of extra money to clear all the face smudges off the windows as people
大量的額外金錢，來清除窗戶上所有臉部留下的污漬，因為人們

[11:35] face smudges off the windows as people were watching the the plane wall off the
臉部留下的污漬，因為人們正在看著飛機第一次在停機坪上滑行的樣子

[11:38] were watching the the plane wall off the roll on the tarmac for the first time um
人們正在看著飛機第一次在停機坪上滑行的樣子，嗯

[11:40] roll on the tarmac for the first time um and so
第一次在停機坪上滑行，嗯，所以

[11:41] and so you know i i think in general everyone
所以，你知道，我認為，一般來說，每個人

[11:43] you know i i think in general everyone that worked at westjet
你知道，我認為，一般來說，在 WestJet 工作的所有人

[11:45] that worked at westjet uh broad brush obviously but i think
在 WestJet 工作的人，嗯，籠統地說，顯然，但我認為

[11:47] uh broad brush obviously but i think everyone was a big fan of of
嗯，籠統地說，顯然，但我認為每個人都是航空和

[11:49] everyone was a big fan of of airlines and uh aircraft um but you know
航空和飛機的忠實粉絲，嗯，但你知道

[11:53] airlines and uh aircraft um but you know back to your kind of question around
航空和飛機的忠實粉絲，嗯，但你知道，回到你關於

[11:57] back to your kind of question around you know how how how do we kind of
回到你關於，你知道，我們怎麼

[12:00] you know how how how do we kind of convey some of the passion that we have
你知道，我們怎麼傳達我們的一些熱情

[12:02] convey some of the passion that we have as loyalty
傳達我們的一些熱情，作為忠誠度

[12:03] as loyalty enthusiasts in a loyalty program and do
忠誠度愛好者，在一個忠誠度計畫中，而且

[12:06] enthusiasts in a loyalty program and do the people that work in that program
忠誠度計畫中的愛好者，而且在這個計畫中工作的人

[12:09] the people that work in that program have the same kind of background and you
在這個計畫中工作的人，是否也有同樣的背景，而且你

[12:11] have the same kind of background and you know to be quite frank
有同樣的背景，而且你知道，坦白說

[12:13] know to be quite frank unfortunately the answer is not a real
坦白說，答案並不是一個真正的

[12:15] unfortunately the answer is not a real positive one in that
不幸的是，答案並不是一個真正的積極的，因為

[12:16] positive one in that a lot of those folks tended to come from
積極的，因為很多那些人傾向於來自

[12:19] a lot of those folks tended to come from different parts of westjet and were kind
很多那些人傾向於來自 WestJet 的不同部門，而且有點

[12:21] different parts of westjet and were kind of
來自 WestJet 的不同部門，而且有點

[12:22] of you know new to loyalty i mean they they
你知道，對忠誠度來說是新的，我的意思是他們

[12:24] you know new to loyalty i mean they they had when i
你知道，對忠誠度來說是新的，我的意思是他們他們在我

[12:25] had when i when i left there were um i think there
在我離開時，我想有

[12:28] when i left there were um i think there was just
在我離開時，我想有

[12:29] was just there were two people um that i'm aware
有兩個人，據我所知

[12:31] there were two people um that i'm aware of that they brought in
有兩個人，據我所知，他們引進了

[12:33] of that they brought in um that had some background in loyalty
他們引進了，他們有一些忠誠度的背景

[12:35] um that had some background in loyalty one worked for avios
他們有一些忠誠度的背景，其中一人曾在 Avios 工作

[12:37] one worked for avios uh the other one who was the director of
其中一人曾在 Avios 工作，另一位是該部門的主管

[12:38] uh the other one who was the director of the group um
另一位是該部門的主管

[12:40] the group um had worked for uh emirates um so he had
該部門曾任職於 Emirates，所以他有

[12:42] had worked for uh emirates um so he had some background
曾任職於 Emirates，所以他有一些背景

[12:43] some background uh he also worked for collison so
一些背景，他也曾在 Collison 工作，所以

[12:45] uh he also worked for collison so understood the lounge side of things
他也曾在 Collison 工作，所以了解休息室方面的事情

[12:47] understood the lounge side of things so it was really interesting talking to
了解休息室方面的事情，所以與...交談真的很有趣

[12:49] so it was really interesting talking to them and getting their perspective on
所以與他們交談並聽取他們的觀點真的很有趣

[12:50] them and getting their perspective on things
聽取他們對事情的觀點

[12:51] things but other people within the group they
事情，但該團隊中的其他人

[12:54] but other people within the group they tended to come from other aspects
但該團隊中的其他人傾向於來自其他方面

[12:56] tended to come from other aspects and the vp who ran the the group
傾向於來自其他方面，而負責該團隊的副總裁

[12:59] and the vp who ran the the group uh actually came from supply chain and
副總裁實際上來自供應鏈，並且

[13:02] uh actually came from supply chain and so
實際上來自供應鏈，所以

[13:03] so there was kind of um a bit of a
所以有點

[13:06] there was kind of um a bit of a challenge
有點挑戰

[13:06] challenge in having people understand the value of
讓人們理解...價值的挑戰

[13:08] in having people understand the value of loyalty and and some of the
讓人們理解忠誠度的價值以及我們試圖做的一些事情

[13:10] loyalty and and some of the uh things that we were trying to do
忠誠度以及我們試圖做的一些事情

[13:12] uh things that we were trying to do often were difficult
我們試圖做的事情通常很困難

[13:14] Often were difficult because not only did we need to convince other departments within WestJet that our ideas were valid and would provide value, but it was also, you know, that we had to take that first step of explaining it and having people within the group of loyalty understand it as well.
經常都很困難，因為我們不僅需要說服 WestJet 內部的其他部門，讓他們相信我們的想法是有效的並且能帶來價值，而且我們還必須，你知道，採取第一步來解釋它，並讓忠誠度團隊中的人們也能理解。

[13:30] So, you know, if you have to kind of explain that there's always going to be some sort of uh information lost in translation.
所以，你知道，如果你必須解釋一下，總會有些資訊在翻譯中丟失。

[13:38] So as they, you know, tried to sell our ideas upwards, they didn't have the same level of understanding or potentially passion of what we were trying to accomplish.
所以當他們，你知道，試圖向上推銷我們的想法時，他們沒有同樣程度的理解，或者可能沒有我們試圖完成的熱情。

[13:49] So it often, I often found it very frustrating trying to get things done.
所以它經常，我經常發現很令人沮喪，試圖把事情做好。

[13:53] Um, you know, somebody, I was actually in charge of the frequent flyer programs, uh, uh, of the redemption partners, as well as our own loyalty program, uh, which is called Member Exclusive, which is the, uh, the award inventory for WestJet.
嗯，你知道，有人，我實際上負責常旅客計劃，呃，呃，兌換合作夥伴，以及我們自己的忠誠度計劃，呃，它叫做會員專享，它是，呃，WestJet 的獎勵庫存。

[14:11] And there were a few interesting things I was trying to do.
而我當時正在嘗試做一些有趣的事情。

[14:15] was trying to do um but we were often at odds with revenue
我試圖做嗯，但我們經常與收入部門意見不合

[14:18] but we were often at odds with revenue management
但我們經常與收入管理部門意見不合

[14:19] management uh whose purpose at the airline is to
管理部門，嗯，他們在航空公司的職責是

[14:22] uh whose purpose at the airline is to make money
嗯，他們的職責是在航空公司賺錢

[14:23] make money uh and as you can imagine uh when i was
賺錢，嗯，你可以想像，嗯，當我在的時候

[14:26] uh and as you can imagine uh when i was there westjet was a publicly traded
嗯，而且你可以想像，嗯，當我在那裡的時候，Westjet 是一家上市公司

[14:27] there westjet was a publicly traded company
那裡 Westjet 是一家上市公司

[14:28] company and so these guys were always interested
公司，所以這些人總是感興趣

[14:31] and so these guys were always interested in
所以這些人總是感興趣

[14:32] in how their their quarterly results looked
他們的季度業績看起來如何

[14:34] how their their quarterly results looked uh so to get
他們的季度業績看起來如何，嗯，所以要獲得

[14:35] uh so to get attention from them to try to
嗯，所以要引起他們的注意，試圖

[14:39] attention from them to try to put forward and develop a long term
引起他們的注意，試圖提出並發展一個長期的

[14:43] put forward and develop a long term idea that would take some time to
提出並發展一個需要一些時間來實施的長期想法

[14:45] idea that would take some time to implement and return value on
想法，該想法需要一些時間來實施並產生價值

[14:47] implement and return value on was often a very difficult challenge
實施並產生價值，這通常是一個非常艱鉅的挑戰

[14:52] yeah and when i'm i don't know how much
是的，當我，我不知道多少

[14:53] yeah and when i'm i don't know how much the program
是的，當我，我不知道這個計劃有多少

[14:55] the program looks like it did when you were there
這個計劃看起來和你當時的一樣

[14:58] looks like it did when you were there uh but when i when i'm glancing at the
看起來和你當時的一樣，嗯，但當我，當我瀏覽

[15:01] uh but when i when i'm glancing at the current benefits what what jumps out to
嗯，但當我，當我瀏覽目前的福利時，什麼最讓我

[15:02] current benefits what what jumps out to me more familiar with uh some of the us
目前的福利，什麼最讓我對美國的一些計劃更熟悉

[15:05] programs is you've got gold which
計劃是你有黃金會員，它

[15:09] six times a year gets advanced seat selection
一年六次獲得預選座位

[15:11] selection but yet gets unlimited lounge access for
選擇，但仍然可以無限制地進入貴賓室

[15:12] but yet gets unlimited lounge access for the traveler and immediate family and
但仍然可以為旅客和直系親屬提供無限貴賓室使用權，以及

[15:16] the traveler and immediate family and guest vouchers.
旅客及隨行家人和貴賓券。

[15:17] Guest vouchers yeah which it it seems to me a US program is absolutely reversed where.
貴賓券，嗯，在我看來，這是一個美國的計畫，完全顛倒了，在那裡。

[15:21] program is absolutely reversed where they'll hand out all kinds of seat selection.
計畫完全顛倒了，在那裡他們會發放各種座位選擇。

[15:25] selection but then lounge access is incredibly hard to come by and I'm curious.
選擇，但貴賓室的通行權卻非常難獲得，我很好奇。

[15:30] hard to come by and I'm curious where where that leads I don't even I guess I don't know the WestJet lounge experience to be honest I've used some of the third-party lounges on Priority Pass when flying WestJet.
難以獲得，我很好奇，這會導向何方，我甚至，我猜我不知道WestJet貴賓室的體驗，說實話，我用過一些Priority Pass的第三方貴賓室，在搭乘WestJet時。

[15:38] Yeah so WestJet um doesn't have currently any of its own lounges uh they're all third-party uh and and largely the same lounges that you're experiencing through Priority Pass.
是的，所以WestJet目前沒有自己的貴賓室，它們都是第三方，而且很大程度上是你透過Priority Pass體驗到的相同貴賓室。

[15:50] However uh the flagship lounge out of Calgary uh is being built uh I don't have a timeline as to when it's supposed to be opening but I believe it's supposed to be later on towards the end of this year.
然而，卡加利的旗艦貴賓室正在建設中，我沒有時間表，不知道它 supposed to 什麼時候開放，但我相信它 supposed to 在今年晚些時候。

[15:56] opening but I believe it's supposed to be later on towards the end of this year I think October was the last I'd heard um the flagship lounge actually is it's a very interesting value proposition there.
開放，但我相信它 supposed to 在今年晚些時候，我記得上次聽說是十月，旗艦貴賓室實際上是一個非常有趣的價值主張。

[16:04] um the flagship lounge actually is it's a very interesting value proposition there um the West side has worked very closely with the Calgary Airport Authority um being that it's based out of Calgary so they have very strong relationships um and the airport authority went so far.
嗯，旗艦貴賓室實際上是一個非常有趣的價值主張，West side 與卡加利機場管理局合作非常密切，因為它總部位於卡加利，所以他們有非常牢固的關係，而機場管理局甚至走得這麼遠。

[16:18] um and the airport authority went so far as to help move the main security checkpoint.
嗯，機場管理局甚至還將主要的安檢點移開。

[16:22] help move the main security checkpoint um from uh a different gate to a gate that's right in front of this new lounge.
將主要的安檢點從一個不同的登機口移到這個新貴賓室前面的一個登機口。

[16:27] that's right in front of this new lounge um to kind of have that uh um view of envy if you couldn't get in when you when you went through security.
就在這個新貴賓室前面，有點像是如果你進不去，當你通過安檢時，會有一種令人羨慕的感覺。

[16:35] uh and so that's that's slated to be open later but what's interesting is that um the head of digital his name is alfredo tan actually came from facebook.
嗯，所以這個計劃晚點開放，但有趣的是，數位部門的負責人，他的名字叫阿爾弗雷多·譚，他其實來自臉書。

[16:44] and he had a lot of contacts within silicon valley and they had what they they called their first ever hackathon um for the westjet lounge and they brought in uh companies like salesforce ibm apple um all facebook all these big companies um to basically have a case competition to come up with ideas on how to uh develop a lounge largely technology based.
他在矽谷有很多聯繫，他們舉辦了他們所謂的第一次黑客松，為 Westjet 貴賓室，他們引進了像 Salesforce、IBM、Apple、臉書等所有這些大公司，基本上是舉辦一個案例競賽，想出如何開發一個以科技為主的貴賓室的點子。

[17:10] based and i don't have all the details of what what they ended up with because budget was always a concern but they were looking at very interesting things like you know if
基於此，我沒有他們最終結果的所有細節，因為預算一直是個問題，但他們正在看一些非常有趣的事情，像是你知道，如果

[17:19] very interesting things like you know if a plane took off
非常有趣的事情，你知道，如果一架飛機起飛

[17:20] a plane took off uh and you could see it uh through the
一架飛機起飛，呃，你可以透過它看到

[17:22] uh and you could see it uh through the the window uh yeah one of the ideas was
呃，你可以透過窗戶看到它，呃，是的，其中一個想法是

[17:24] the window uh yeah one of the ideas was to have
窗戶，呃，是的，其中一個想法是擁有

[17:25] to have kind of a marker track uh where that
擁有某種標記軌道，呃，在那裡

[17:27] kind of a marker track uh where that plane was going to and
某種標記軌道，呃，那架飛機將飛往何處，以及

[17:28] plane was going to and cares about the flight things like that
飛機將飛往何處，並關心飛行等事項

[17:30] cares about the flight things like that very interactive
關心飛行等事項，非常互動

[17:32] very interactive uh but you know with with all the the
非常互動，呃，但你知道，隨著所有

[17:34] uh but you know with with all the the changes of what's happened with covid i
呃，但你知道，隨著 covid 發生的一切變化，我

[17:36] changes of what's happened with covid i have no idea what's actually going to be
covid 發生的一切變化，我不知道實際上會是什麼

[17:37] have no idea what's actually going to be in that lounge
不知道實際上會是什麼在那個貴賓室裡

[17:38] in that lounge um but you know in terms of
在那個貴賓室裡，嗯，但你知道，就而言

[17:42] um but you know in terms of why did they do the unlimited lounge
嗯，但你知道，就為什麼他們設立了無限貴賓室而言

[17:45] why did they do the unlimited lounge i alluded to the fact that um you know
為什麼他們設立了無限貴賓室，我提到了一個事實，嗯，你知道

[17:48] i alluded to the fact that um you know learning what what is a value to our top
我提到了一個事實，嗯，你知道，了解什麼對我們的頂級會員有價值

[17:51] learning what what is a value to our top tier members
了解什麼對我們的頂級會員有價值

[17:52] tier members uh was that you know they they travel
級會員，呃，你知道他們經常旅行

[17:54] uh was that you know they they travel plenty
呃，你知道他們經常旅行

[17:55] plenty for for work and a lot of times you know
為了工作，而且很多時候，你知道

[17:58] for for work and a lot of times you know they get all these the ancillaries paid
為了工作，而且很多時候，你知道他們獲得了所有這些附加服務的支付

[18:00] they get all these the ancillaries paid for by their their work so you know they
他們獲得了所有這些附加服務的支付，由他們的工作支付，所以你知道他們

[18:02] for by their their work so you know they see selection they get free bag all that
由他們的工作支付，所以你知道他們看到選擇，他們得到免費行李，所有那些

[18:04] see selection they get free bag all that stuff is is
看到選擇，他們得到免費行李，所有這些東西都是

[18:05] stuff is is just it's it's nothing to them right so
東西就是，對他們來說什麼都不是，對吧，所以

[18:08] just it's it's nothing to them right so what really matters to them um and i
就是，對他們來說什麼都不是，對吧，所以什麼對他們來說真正重要，嗯，我

[18:10] what really matters to them um and i think you probably hear this
什麼對他們來說真正重要，嗯，我認為你可能聽過這個

[18:11] think you probably hear this many times is that as a road warrior
你可能聽過很多次，那就是作為一個經常出差的商務人士

[18:14] many times is that as a road warrior because you're away from
很多次，那就是作為一個經常出差的商務人士，因為你離開了

[18:15] because you're away from from home for so long that when you
因為你離開家這麼久，所以當你

[18:17] from home for so long that when you actually take a family vacation
離開家這麼久，所以當你真的帶家人去度假時

[18:19] actually take a family vacation uh you want to show off to your family
真的帶家人去度假，呃，你想在家人面前炫耀

[18:21] uh you want to show off to your family that hey look this is what
嗯，你想向家人炫耀，嘿，看，這就是

[18:23] that hey look this is what you know me being away gets us as a
嘿，看，這就是你知道我不在家能為我們家帶來的

[18:25] you know me being away gets us as a family while we travel
你知道我不在家能為我們家在旅行時帶來的

[18:26] family while we travel which is why they're allowing unlimited
家人在旅行時，這就是為什麼他們允許無限次

[18:30] which is why they're allowing unlimited access to lounges
這就是為什麼他們允許無限次進入貴賓室

[18:31] access to lounges for the member as well as family members
會員以及家庭成員都可以進入貴賓室

[18:33] for the member as well as family members so that that is kind of a unique
會員以及家庭成員，所以這有點獨特

[18:35] so that that is kind of a unique offering that you don't see very often
所以這有點獨特，你很少見到這樣的服務

[18:37] offering that you don't see very often in lounges and
你很少在貴賓室見到的服務，而且

[18:38] in lounges and and you could have a very large family
在貴賓室，而且你可以有一個非常大的家庭

[18:40] and you could have a very large family group i think it's up to eight people
你可以有一個非常大的家庭團體，我認為最多可以有八個人

[18:42] group i think it's up to eight people um family so you know that's that's
團體，我認為最多可以有八個人，嗯，家庭，所以你知道，這總是

[18:45] um family so you know that's that's always nice you know as
嗯，家庭，所以你知道，這總是很好，你知道，作為

[18:46] always nice you know as as a traveler when i travel with my wife
總是很好，你知道，作為一個旅行者，當我和我的妻子一起旅行時

[18:48] as a traveler when i travel with my wife and daughter it nothing irks me more
作為一個旅行者，當我和我的妻子及女兒一起旅行時，沒有什麼比這更讓我惱火的了

[18:51] and daughter it nothing irks me more than
和女兒，沒有什麼比這更讓我惱火的了

[18:51] than um going into a lounge uh like a
比嗯，進入一個貴賓室，呃，像一個

[18:53] um going into a lounge uh like a priority pass lounge where
嗯，進入一個貴賓室，呃，像一個優先通行證貴賓室，在那裡

[18:55] priority pass lounge where you know i've got two access for two but
優先通行證貴賓室，你知道，我有兩個人的通行權，但是

[18:57] you know i've got two access for two but my daughter who you know barely eats
你知道，我有兩個人的通行權，但是我的女兒，你知道，她幾乎不吃東西

[18:59] my daughter who you know barely eats just needs to be with us
我的女兒，你知道，她幾乎不吃東西，只是需要和我們在一起

[19:00] just needs to be with us gets turned 27 us dollars right that
只是需要和我們在一起，卻要收27美元，對吧，這

[19:03] gets turned 27 us dollars right that that just irks me a lot
卻要收27美元，這真的讓我很惱火

[19:05] that just irks me a lot so you know i can imagine that you know
這真的讓我很惱火，所以你知道，我可以想像，你知道

[19:06] so you know i can imagine that you know as a frequent flyer
所以你知道，我可以想像，你知道，作為一個常旅客

[19:08] as a frequent flyer if you're traveling for for vacation on
作為一個常旅客，如果你是為了度假而旅行

[19:10] if you're traveling for for vacation on your with your family and
如果你是為了度假而和家人一起旅行，而且

[19:11] your with your family and being told at the door that you could
和家人在一起，卻在門口被告知你只能

[19:13] being told at the door that you could only get one other person in
在門口被告知你只能帶一個人進去

[19:15] only get one other person in um that could be quite bothersome um
只能帶一個人進去，嗯，這可能會很煩人，嗯

[19:18] um that could be quite bothersome um you know financially it's an interesting
嗯，這可能會很煩人，嗯，你知道，從經濟上來說，這很有趣

[19:21] you know financially it's an interesting um
你知道，從經濟上來說，這很有趣，嗯

[19:21] um interesting approach because it can be interesting approach because it can be quite expensive to have people in lounge so uh yeah it'll be it'll be interesting to see if they pair back that benefit or not
嗯，這是一個有趣的策略，因為讓人們待在貴賓室可能相當昂貴，所以嗯，是的，看看他們是否會取消這項福利，還是很有趣的。

[19:32] yeah and flagship lounge when i hear words like that it doesn't sound like they're trying to be a a uh a budget airline it sounds like they're they're they're ramping up and going after air canada well yeah that's that's the intent
是的，還有旗艦貴賓室，當我聽到這樣的話時，聽起來不像他們想成為一家廉價航空公司，聽起來他們正在加緊努力，爭奪加拿大航空的市場，嗯，是的，這就是意圖。

[19:44] um now i guess the the challenge is that uh you know air canada is the incumbent um and they they really understand their top tier members um and and uh you know the lounges have been uh really good for a long time uh and the advent of their signature series lounges uh in vancouver and toronto uh make it even that much more attractive to be an air canada top tier member
嗯，現在我想挑戰在於，你知道，加拿大航空是現任者，他們非常了解他們的頂級會員，而且你知道，貴賓室一直以來都很好，他們的 Signature Series 貴賓室在溫哥華和多倫多的出現，讓成為加拿大航空的頂級會員更具吸引力。

[20:09] um but when i when i moved over to westjet one of the reasons i did so was uh the launch of the 787 and the idea that they were actually going uh to put a business class that was comparable to air canada and in some respects even better excuse
嗯，但是當我轉到 WestJet 時，我這樣做的原因之一是 787 的推出，以及他們實際上將推出與加拿大航空相當，甚至在某些方面更好的商務艙的想法。

[20:23] and in some respects even better excuse me um

[20:24] me um the the person who actually uh designed

[20:27] the the person who actually uh designed the

[20:27] the uh westjet pods uh

[20:30] uh westjet pods uh was the same guy who did the q suites

[20:32] was the same guy who did the q suites for cutter and

[20:34] for cutter and he's since moved on to air italy but

[20:37] he's since moved on to air italy but you know it was almost like budget

[20:40] you know it was almost like budget wasn't

[20:40] wasn't much of a concern when they decided to

[20:42] much of a concern when they decided to develop business class because they

[20:43] develop business class because they really wanted to go after the business

[20:45] really wanted to go after the business traveler

[20:46] traveler and so all of that included uh you know

[20:50] and so all of that included uh you know things that we talked about earlier

[20:51] things that we talked about earlier which is

[20:52] which is uh both the hard product and the soft

[20:54] uh both the hard product and the soft product so um you know when we

[20:55] product so um you know when we when i toured the 787 the first time i

[20:58] when i toured the 787 the first time i was pretty impressed

[20:59] was pretty impressed you know they had some very nuanced

[21:01] you know they had some very nuanced touches um

[21:02] touches um that that are quite unique uh as a

[21:04] that that are quite unique uh as a canadian airline for example

[21:06] canadian airline for example you know if you're flying to europe and

[21:08] you know if you're flying to europe and you're you're doing a red-eye

[21:10] you're you're doing a red-eye as you're starting to land uh you hear

[21:12] as you're starting to land uh you hear the the call of the loon

[21:13] the the call of the loon uh famous canadian bird as your wake-up

[21:16] uh famous canadian bird as your wake-up call as the lights start coming up

[21:18] call as the lights start coming up uh and so just you know just very small

[21:21] uh and so just you know just very small touches like that

[21:22] touches like that um the food is actually excellent uh

[21:24] um the food is actually excellent uh some of the better food i've had on uh

[21:27] some of the better food i've had on uh in a domestic uh business class and

[21:30] in a domestic uh business class and they had flown that flight uh from

[21:33] they had flown that flight uh from calgary to toronto as they were getting

[21:34] calgary to toronto as they were getting their certification

[21:35] their certification uh and so i flew it i think three times

[21:38] uh and so i flew it i think three times in business class and it was it was

[21:40] in business class and it was it was excellent

[21:40] excellent very great service um but uh yeah they

[21:44] very great service um but uh yeah they were definitely going after the air

[21:45] were definitely going after the air canada

[21:46] canada uh top tier members um but it it was

[21:49] uh top tier members um but it it was definitely a challenge because uh you

[21:51] definitely a challenge because uh you know as as you know

[21:52] know as as you know once you become uh you know a million

[21:55] once you become uh you know a million miler or a diamond member or a 100k

[21:59] miler or a diamond member or a 100k super elite it it comes very difficult

[22:02] super elite it it comes very difficult to pry those people away and

[22:03] to pry those people away and but that that is the intent was to try

[22:06] but that that is the intent was to try to secure some of those um

[22:08] to secure some of those um big margin people uh to come over to

[22:10] big margin people uh to come over to westjet and

[22:11] westjet and you know they were making changes to um

[22:14] you know they were making changes to um the the hard products uh on both the 787

[22:18] the the hard products uh on both the 787 which was brand new

[22:19] which was brand new as well as retrofitting all the 737s

[22:22] as well as retrofitting all the 737s that they've got

[22:23] that they've got to a true business class uh so uh or

[22:26] to a true business class uh so uh or domestic business class which was two by

[22:28] domestic business class which was two by two

[22:28] two uh previously uh they were three by

[22:31] uh previously uh they were three by three with a blocked middle

[22:32] three with a blocked middle so european business class and to be

[22:35] so european business class and to be frank it was nothing special so

[22:37] frank it was nothing special so uh they were really um upping their game

[22:40] uh they were really um upping their game and spending a little bit

[22:41] and spending a little bit of money to try to get that uh going um

[22:44] of money to try to get that uh going um but like i said air canada has had that

[22:46] but like i said air canada has had that that product for a very long time um

[22:49] that product for a very long time um you know it'll be interesting to see if

[22:51] you know it'll be interesting to see if they can pry away some of those top tier

[22:52] they can pry away some of those top tier members

[22:54] members seems like calgary as a base makes a lot

[22:57] seems like calgary as a base makes a lot of sense both

[22:58] of sense both geography and industry wise

[23:01] geography and industry wise yeah yeah um interestingly you know when

[23:04] yeah yeah um interestingly you know when we

[23:05] we launched the 787 um we

[23:08] launched the 787 um we we partnered well the jv with delta i

[23:11] we partnered well the jv with delta i think is finalized now but i'm not 100

[23:13] think is finalized now but i'm not 100 sure but

[23:14] sure but one of the reasons the the jv was put in

[23:16] one of the reasons the the jv was put in place

[23:17] place um was the idea that uh delta has a a

[23:21] um was the idea that uh delta has a a pretty strong network on the west coast

[23:24] pretty strong network on the west coast uh and the idea was that it would uh it

[23:26] uh and the idea was that it would uh it would filter or bring people to calgary

[23:28] would filter or bring people to calgary as a international hub

[23:30] as a international hub and as the 787 started establishing

[23:32] and as the 787 started establishing international routes

[23:34] international routes um you know they fly to london paris uh

[23:36] um you know they fly to london paris uh dublin

[23:37] dublin and uh barcelona now i believe um and

[23:40] and uh barcelona now i believe um and now rome i think

[23:42] now rome i think and uh uh as they expand the idea was to

[23:45] and uh uh as they expand the idea was to take some of that international travel

[23:47] take some of that international travel with the weaker canadian dollar and

[23:50] with the weaker canadian dollar and a pretty strong uh product uh to be able

[23:52] a pretty strong uh product uh to be able to fly americans

[23:54] to fly americans uh with a stop over in calgary and then

[23:56] uh with a stop over in calgary and then fly over to

[23:57] fly over to europe or potentially asia in the future

[24:01] europe or potentially asia in the future i'll be all for it delta flyer uh award

[24:03] i'll be all for it delta flyer uh award pricing is so problematic for delta with

[24:06] pricing is so problematic for delta with all of its partners including westjet

[24:07] all of its partners including westjet that it's

[24:08] that it's often additive it's whatever the westjet

[24:10] often additive it's whatever the westjet flight would cost

[24:12] flight would cost plus delta adding you know the bazillion

[24:14] plus delta adding you know the bazillion that miles

[24:16] that miles they might do and then it it seems to

[24:17] they might do and then it it seems to have a magnifying effect when you

[24:19] have a magnifying effect when you you know the alchemy of the two together

[24:22] you know the alchemy of the two together so i remember

[24:22] so i remember i've never redeemed a delta award on

[24:26] i've never redeemed a delta award on westjet

[24:26] westjet it's because of that yeah they're paid

[24:28] it's because of that yeah they're paid cash yeah

[24:30] cash yeah um asking oh hersty had a great

[24:32] um asking oh hersty had a great experience flying to saint martin where

[24:35] experience flying to saint martin where his westjet flight was delayed and they

[24:37] his westjet flight was delayed and they uh compensated him for

[24:39] uh compensated him for missing his uh flight onward flight to

[24:41] missing his uh flight onward flight to seba which was on an entirely different

[24:42] seba which was on an entirely different airline so he's

[24:44] airline so he's he's well disposed to westjet but he's

[24:46] he's well disposed to westjet but he's asking what do you think of westjet

[24:48] asking what do you think of westjet dollars

[24:48] dollars so this is the rewards currency instead

[24:50] so this is the rewards currency instead of what uh

[24:51] of what uh some might call miles so i i have a very

[24:55] some might call miles so i i have a very interesting relationship with westjet

[24:57] interesting relationship with westjet dollars um

[24:58] dollars um i really dislike them um and and the

[25:01] i really dislike them um and and the reason

[25:02] reason is that you know as a westjetter i saw

[25:05] is that you know as a westjetter i saw that the westjet dollar

[25:07] that the westjet dollar was something that really held westjet

[25:10] was something that really held westjet back

[25:10] back um in terms of being able to generate

[25:12] um in terms of being able to generate revenue and

[25:13] revenue and stefan i'm sure that you can appreciate

[25:15] stefan i'm sure that you can appreciate that airlines generate a ton of revenue

[25:18] that airlines generate a ton of revenue through their currencies

[25:20] through their currencies it was very very difficult to

[25:23] it was very very difficult to really make any sort of money on by

[25:26] really make any sort of money on by selling westjet dollars

[25:27] selling westjet dollars simply because um one one westjet dollar

[25:30] simply because um one one westjet dollar was equivalent of one canadian dollar

[25:33] was equivalent of one canadian dollar um so it's not like you could buy uh you

[25:35] um so it's not like you could buy uh you know

[25:36] know um i don't know a pack of gum and get

[25:38] um i don't know a pack of gum and get you know uh a one west you have dollar

[25:40] you know uh a one west you have dollar for it right that would be ridiculous

[25:43] for it right that would be ridiculous is that they don't they don't have

[25:44] is that they don't they don't have fractional west yet dollars so you

[25:46] fractional west yet dollars so you couldn't earn like

[25:47] couldn't earn like uh three westjet cents or something like

[25:49] uh three westjet cents or something like that on a pack of gum

[25:50] that on a pack of gum and even if you could right um how

[25:53] and even if you could right um how how how rewarding is it to to earn three

[25:56] how how rewarding is it to to earn three westjet cents on a pack of gum like it

[25:58] westjet cents on a pack of gum like it just

[25:59] just you would you'd think like this is going

[26:00] you would you'd think like this is going to take forever to get anywhere

[26:02] to take forever to get anywhere uh the other problem it's like a slim

[26:05] uh the other problem it's like a slim forms episode where they're going to

[26:06] forms episode where they're going to crusty land and

[26:08] crusty land and trade my money for these fun dollars

[26:10] trade my money for these fun dollars yeah exactly

[26:12] yeah exactly develop because they're fun

[26:15] i mean the other problem is that westjet

[26:18] i mean the other problem is that westjet has done itself

[26:19] has done itself quite a disservice in that westjet

[26:21] quite a disservice in that westjet dollars

[26:22] dollars for canadians they're largely known as

[26:24] for canadians they're largely known as basically an offset on a regular price

[26:26] basically an offset on a regular price ticket

[26:28] ticket so i mentioned member exclusive which is

[26:29] so i mentioned member exclusive which is the distressed inventory of westjet

[26:32] the distressed inventory of westjet and again they've done themselves a huge

[26:34] and again they've done themselves a huge disservice

[26:35] disservice rate currently member exclusive fares

[26:38] rate currently member exclusive fares are no longer available

[26:39] are no longer available on westjet because they're quote

[26:42] on westjet because they're quote uh updating the system i don't know what

[26:44] uh updating the system i don't know what they're actually doing they have been

[26:45] they're actually doing they have been very secretive about it

[26:48] very secretive about it but even if it was in place people

[26:51] but even if it was in place people didn't really understand

[26:52] didn't really understand what what member exclusive fares were so

[26:55] what what member exclusive fares were so very poor marketing there um you know i

[26:58] very poor marketing there um you know i i knew about it obviously because i ran

[26:59] i knew about it obviously because i ran the program but

[27:00] the program but um you know for it it can be quite

[27:03] um you know for it it can be quite lucrative right so you can fly

[27:05] lucrative right so you can fly transcon from vancouver to new york

[27:08] transcon from vancouver to new york anywhere from

[27:09] anywhere from in canada and the us for 125 westjet

[27:12] in canada and the us for 125 westjet dollars one way plus tax so

[27:14] dollars one way plus tax so roughly about i think it's about 40

[27:16] roughly about i think it's about 40 canadian um for taxes if you're coming

[27:18] canadian um for taxes if you're coming out of a canadian airport because of the

[27:20] out of a canadian airport because of the airport taxes

[27:21] airport taxes but essentially for you know 160 170

[27:24] but essentially for you know 160 170 dollars

[27:26] dollars that you can fly transcon and the award

[27:29] that you can fly transcon and the award availability was insane it was it was

[27:31] availability was insane it was it was quite

[27:31] quite quite generous but people didn't know

[27:33] quite generous but people didn't know about it and what other

[27:35] about it and what other another thing that people didn't know is

[27:36] another thing that people didn't know is that um westjet dollars

[27:38] that um westjet dollars uh the idea was that you had to earn

[27:40] uh the idea was that you had to earn them through the credit card

[27:42] them through the credit card or flying on westjet but because of the

[27:44] or flying on westjet but because of the points partnership with

[27:45] points partnership with points.com you would actually go through

[27:48] points.com you would actually go through the flow and

[27:49] the flow and search for a member exclusive fare uh

[27:51] search for a member exclusive fare uh the idea was that you had to have 100 of

[27:53] the idea was that you had to have 100 of the westjet dollars in your account

[27:54] the westjet dollars in your account in order to redeem um but as part of the

[27:57] in order to redeem um but as part of the flow

[27:58] flow as you walk through the process if the

[28:00] as you walk through the process if the system detected you didn't have enough

[28:01] system detected you didn't have enough westjet dollars they would just redirect

[28:03] westjet dollars they would just redirect you to points.com where you could buy

[28:05] you to points.com where you could buy the westjet dollars

[28:06] the westjet dollars almost on par um you could buy uh

[28:10] almost on par um you could buy uh 3 000 westjet dollars for something like

[28:14] 3 000 westjet dollars for something like a hundred and fifty dollars in uh fees

[28:18] a hundred and fifty dollars in uh fees uh which is insane

[28:21] uh which is insane and so canadian company right they don't

[28:24] and so canadian company right they don't have an excuse for

[28:25] have an excuse for yeah misunderstanding about how this

[28:28] yeah misunderstanding about how this should work

[28:29] should work yeah so so i hated it for that reason in

[28:32] yeah so so i hated it for that reason in that

[28:32] that um it wasn't an engaging points program

[28:34] um it wasn't an engaging points program um but the other thing i really disliked

[28:36] um but the other thing i really disliked about it was that um you couldn't

[28:38] about it was that um you couldn't sell those points to retailers because

[28:40] sell those points to retailers because it was just too

[28:41] it was just too too expensive i mean right now um the

[28:44] too expensive i mean right now um the biggest

[28:45] biggest purchaser of westjet dollars is rbc the

[28:47] purchaser of westjet dollars is rbc the the financial institute

[28:49] the financial institute partner and you know the in order to

[28:52] partner and you know the in order to earn one westjet dollar you actually

[28:53] earn one westjet dollar you actually have to spend about 66.66

[28:56] have to spend about 66.66 in order to earn one less jet dollar um

[28:59] in order to earn one less jet dollar um and so you can imagine uh if if you're a

[29:02] and so you can imagine uh if if you're a retailer and you're telling your people

[29:04] retailer and you're telling your people um that your customers that you have to

[29:05] um that your customers that you have to spend almost 70 earn one less jet dollar

[29:09] spend almost 70 earn one less jet dollar i mean it's not a very exciting value

[29:11] i mean it's not a very exciting value proposition

[29:12] proposition um and again even if you did spend

[29:14] um and again even if you did spend seventy dollars at a retailer and you

[29:16] seventy dollars at a retailer and you got one westjet dollar it's like

[29:18] got one westjet dollar it's like what am i going to do with one less jet

[29:19] what am i going to do with one less jet dollar offset the the price of a ticket

[29:22] dollar offset the the price of a ticket by a dollar like what

[29:23] by a dollar like what why would i collect that currency and so

[29:26] why would i collect that currency and so it becomes um

[29:27] it becomes um an issue that you can't sell that

[29:28] an issue that you can't sell that currency and therefore you can't

[29:30] currency and therefore you can't raise uh revenue for the airline and

[29:33] raise uh revenue for the airline and therefore you can't use that revenue to

[29:35] therefore you can't use that revenue to improve the program so

[29:36] improve the program so um you know westjet is caught in a

[29:39] um you know westjet is caught in a vicious cycle

[29:40] vicious cycle whereas um you know aeroplan who's just

[29:43] whereas um you know aeroplan who's just launched a new program

[29:45] launched a new program uh is caught in what i believe is a

[29:47] uh is caught in what i believe is a virtuous cycle so they have a very

[29:48] virtuous cycle so they have a very manageable currency program they've got

[29:51] manageable currency program they've got excellent

[29:52] excellent flight availability a great network and

[29:54] flight availability a great network and now with no yq in their program

[29:57] now with no yq in their program people are going to want to fly the

[29:58] people are going to want to fly the program and then as people start

[30:00] program and then as people start collecting points they're going to

[30:01] collecting points they're going to demand from the retailers that they want

[30:03] demand from the retailers that they want to be able to collect points

[30:04] to be able to collect points and then as they demand that retailers

[30:06] and then as they demand that retailers need to start buying points from

[30:08] need to start buying points from air canada and and as people are as

[30:10] air canada and and as people are as retailers start buying points then

[30:11] retailers start buying points then there's more money to invest back into

[30:13] there's more money to invest back into the program get more

[30:14] the program get more uh flight reward availability within air

[30:16] uh flight reward availability within air canada and negotiate better pro

[30:18] canada and negotiate better pro or better access to reward inventory

[30:21] or better access to reward inventory with partners you know all these things

[30:23] with partners you know all these things um they're going in the right direction

[30:25] um they're going in the right direction whereas westjet i believe is going the

[30:26] whereas westjet i believe is going the opposite

[30:27] opposite wrong direction yeah it was uh

[30:31] wrong direction yeah it was uh a taste of the danforth in toronto five

[30:33] a taste of the danforth in toronto five years ago and i

[30:35] years ago and i i did a joking blog post about how bad

[30:37] i did a joking blog post about how bad the card bonuses are because there was a

[30:39] the card bonuses are because there was a card uh

[30:41] card uh it was a toronto fc air miles card you

[30:43] it was a toronto fc air miles card you get 400 mile

[30:45] get 400 mile bonus and then i got lectured of how

[30:49] bonus and then i got lectured of how it's actually

[30:50] it's actually worth something but i mean related to

[30:52] worth something but i mean related to i'm looking at westjet

[30:53] i'm looking at westjet rewards tears and benefits which i

[30:56] rewards tears and benefits which i i live and breed loyalty programs as a

[30:59] i live and breed loyalty programs as a hobby i

[31:00] hobby i i can understand most i've encountered

[31:02] i can understand most i've encountered except the new united program

[31:04] except the new united program but i i cannot for the life of me figure

[31:07] but i i cannot for the life of me figure out

[31:08] out it says the tier is on 100

[31:11] it says the tier is on 100 of westjet marketed flights flown but

[31:14] of westjet marketed flights flown but then it says earn westjet dollars at

[31:16] then it says earn westjet dollars at these rates

[31:17] these rates teal 0.5 percent silver 3

[31:21] teal 0.5 percent silver 3 gold 5 percent platinum 8 for flying

[31:23] gold 5 percent platinum 8 for flying westjet flights that

[31:25] westjet flights that that means absolutely nothing to me i

[31:27] that means absolutely nothing to me i don't know eight percent of of what and

[31:29] don't know eight percent of of what and how that

[31:33] how that it's complicated and unless you're

[31:34] it's complicated and unless you're really um willing to invest

[31:37] really um willing to invest and understand what the program is you

[31:38] and understand what the program is you you at a glance you would have no idea

[31:40] you at a glance you would have no idea what that means

[31:41] what that means um what it actually means is that as a

[31:43] um what it actually means is that as a platinum you would

[31:44] platinum you would earn eight percent of your base uh fair

[31:48] earn eight percent of your base uh fair spend

[31:48] spend uh back in westjet dollars uh and so

[31:52] uh back in westjet dollars uh and so uh you know if you if you have the

[31:54] uh you know if you if you have the westjet credit card it gives you another

[31:55] westjet credit card it gives you another two percent so

[31:56] two percent so in actuality as a platinum member

[31:58] in actuality as a platinum member holding the credit card

[32:00] holding the credit card and putting flights on the credit card

[32:01] and putting flights on the credit card you're earning 10 back which is actually

[32:03] you're earning 10 back which is actually incredibly

[32:05] incredibly generous um but you know

[32:08] generous um but you know going back to the idea that uh the

[32:10] going back to the idea that uh the person who runs the program is in supply

[32:12] person who runs the program is in supply chain

[32:13] chain uh and um has to answer for financial

[32:17] uh and um has to answer for financial [Music]

[32:19] [Music] results uh you you you don't know the

[32:21] results uh you you you don't know the program but

[32:22] program but um the way they got to eight percent

[32:24] um the way they got to eight percent with the platinum

[32:26] with the platinum is that they took away half a percent

[32:28] is that they took away half a percent from the teals

[32:29] from the teals uh so as you can imagine um as

[32:32] uh so as you can imagine um as as someone who's looking to join a new

[32:34] as someone who's looking to join a new program as a new flyer imagine you're a

[32:36] program as a new flyer imagine you're a new executive and you're gonna fly a lot

[32:38] new executive and you're gonna fly a lot and you have a choice of air canada or

[32:40] and you have a choice of air canada or westjet

[32:42] westjet well number one you have to start as a

[32:44] well number one you have to start as a teal so how attractive is earning

[32:46] teal so how attractive is earning point five percent or sorry point five

[32:49] point five percent or sorry point five uh

[32:49] uh of a dollar uh for for every dollar you

[32:52] of a dollar uh for for every dollar you spend

[32:53] spend in order to get up to uh the platinum

[32:55] in order to get up to uh the platinum level where it's actually

[32:56] level where it's actually makes sense right so you're not likely

[32:58] makes sense right so you're not likely to join the program

[32:59] to join the program and you'll just go straight to air

[33:01] and you'll just go straight to air canada which again this is

[33:03] canada which again this is one of my problems with with the program

[33:05] one of my problems with with the program and the people that run it is that

[33:07] and the people that run it is that you know it's cutting off your nose to

[33:09] you know it's cutting off your nose to spite your face

[33:10] spite your face sure you're you're making more attracted

[33:12] sure you're you're making more attracted to the platinum members but

[33:14] to the platinum members but what happens to your funnel of people

[33:15] what happens to your funnel of people that are growing into the program

[33:17] that are growing into the program they're not going to get started

[33:18] they're not going to get started because the the the value proposition at

[33:20] because the the the value proposition at the low end is so poor

[33:22] the low end is so poor that um you're they're likely to start

[33:24] that um you're they're likely to start another program

[33:25] another program so i these are some of the things that

[33:27] so i these are some of the things that weren't considered

[33:29] weren't considered um when they relaunched the program and

[33:32] um when they relaunched the program and introduced the platinum tier uh and you

[33:35] introduced the platinum tier uh and you know you don't hear a lot about it

[33:36] know you don't hear a lot about it because

[33:37] because you know people that are new into the

[33:38] you know people that are new into the program or or teal members

[33:41] program or or teal members uh or even silver members they tend not

[33:43] uh or even silver members they tend not to be the ones that

[33:45] to be the ones that are very uh engaged with programs so

[33:48] are very uh engaged with programs so they don't tend to complain a lot

[33:49] they don't tend to complain a lot they're not the ones on fire talk right

[33:51] they're not the ones on fire talk right and they're not the ones uh

[33:52] and they're not the ones uh yelling and uh getting news stories

[33:54] yelling and uh getting news stories printed about it but um

[33:56] printed about it but um you know i can tell you what happened

[33:58] you know i can tell you what happened though you guys are sorry don't yell

[33:59] though you guys are sorry don't yell ever

[34:03] but yeah i mean like i think uh in

[34:05] but yeah i mean like i think uh in general i think long

[34:06] general i think long term i think the westjet program's in a

[34:08] term i think the westjet program's in a lot of trouble because uh

[34:10] lot of trouble because uh they have really reduced the funnel in

[34:11] they have really reduced the funnel in terms of number of people that are

[34:13] terms of number of people that are wanting to join the program

[34:14] wanting to join the program organically that that is a big hurdle to

[34:18] organically that that is a big hurdle to get over that deal when i look at the

[34:19] get over that deal when i look at the dollar requirements

[34:20] dollar requirements and i mean that whole thing about the

[34:22] and i mean that whole thing about the dollars i unders

[34:24] dollars i unders i i feel like that's i can see how it's

[34:28] i i feel like that's i can see how it's it's some it's clear and it makes sense

[34:31] it's some it's clear and it makes sense to the bottom line but i also feel like

[34:33] to the bottom line but i also feel like there was something

[34:34] there was something so magical across the world across

[34:37] so magical across the world across flyers

[34:37] flyers of a mile and it captivated

[34:41] of a mile and it captivated 30 40 years of travelers with this

[34:43] 30 40 years of travelers with this incredible marketing innovation

[34:45] incredible marketing innovation and however you made it work there was

[34:48] and however you made it work there was something almost democratic in one sense

[34:50] something almost democratic in one sense but incredibly elitist in another

[34:52] but incredibly elitist in another and it captivated people and the dollars

[34:54] and it captivated people and the dollars like i said the

[34:55] like i said the new united program i i used to be a 1k

[34:58] new united program i i used to be a 1k flyer i don't i didn't even invest the

[34:59] flyer i don't i didn't even invest the time to

[35:00] time to try to understand the pops and the this

[35:03] try to understand the pops and the this and that

[35:04] and that it it just doesn't connect to travel i

[35:06] it it just doesn't connect to travel i love

[35:07] love yeah and i you know i had this argument

[35:09] yeah and i you know i had this argument many many times

[35:10] many many times is that you know the whole world runs on

[35:14] is that you know the whole world runs on miles and points

[35:15] miles and points like do you think that somehow the

[35:18] like do you think that somehow the entire loyalty world that's been

[35:20] entire loyalty world that's been established for

[35:21] established for you know 40 50 years that they missed

[35:24] you know 40 50 years that they missed the boat and you got it right with

[35:25] the boat and you got it right with dollars like you're the only program

[35:27] dollars like you're the only program that does this

[35:29] that does this and do you think that you're right i

[35:31] and do you think that you're right i just don't understand

[35:32] just don't understand how how they've stayed with westjet

[35:34] how how they've stayed with westjet dollars for so long and

[35:36] dollars for so long and uh you know i'm quite passionate about

[35:38] uh you know i'm quite passionate about this idea but um

[35:39] this idea but um you know the whole idea was at the start

[35:41] you know the whole idea was at the start of the program was to make it easy to

[35:43] of the program was to make it easy to understand

[35:44] understand for canadians and easy to redeem and it

[35:46] for canadians and easy to redeem and it is

[35:47] is um but again you know you spend uh

[35:50] um but again you know you spend uh you know thousands of dollars and you

[35:52] you know thousands of dollars and you end up with you know 150 westjet dollars

[35:54] end up with you know 150 westjet dollars and most people are just gonna

[35:56] and most people are just gonna take that off the price of the ticket

[35:57] take that off the price of the ticket that they pay retail

[35:59] that they pay retail and like that's not rewarding at all

[36:01] and like that's not rewarding at all like it doesn't feel free it doesn't

[36:03] like it doesn't feel free it doesn't feel like you're

[36:04] feel like you're really benefiting from the program um

[36:06] really benefiting from the program um you know they do have one

[36:08] you know they do have one real decent benefit with a credit card

[36:10] real decent benefit with a credit card which is the uh

[36:11] which is the uh the travel uh companion voucher which um

[36:14] the travel uh companion voucher which um previously was quite good um at uh

[36:16] previously was quite good um at uh domestically you could fly

[36:18] domestically you could fly 99 um return

[36:22] 99 um return uh as long as you bought a base fare for

[36:24] uh as long as you bought a base fare for the first person

[36:25] the first person and not even allowed you to go into the

[36:28] and not even allowed you to go into the the premium economy or the the european

[36:31] the premium economy or the the european business class i talked about

[36:32] business class i talked about so it could save you quite a bit of

[36:34] so it could save you quite a bit of money so if you say for example flew

[36:37] money so if you say for example flew vancouver to new york and flew in um

[36:40] vancouver to new york and flew in um westjet premium economy um you know

[36:43] westjet premium economy um you know maybe that costs you

[36:45] maybe that costs you i don't know fifteen hundred dollars

[36:46] i don't know fifteen hundred dollars return um but the second person would be

[36:48] return um but the second person would be ninety nine dollars plus tax which is

[36:50] ninety nine dollars plus tax which is pretty

[36:50] pretty it's a it's a interesting value

[36:52] it's a it's a interesting value proposition but

[36:54] proposition but not everyone took advantage of it uh you

[36:56] not everyone took advantage of it uh you know about 50

[36:57] know about 50 of people that have those uh

[37:00] of people that have those uh certificates end up

[37:01] certificates end up cashing them in so um you know it is

[37:04] cashing them in so um you know it is one of those things uh in the credit

[37:06] one of those things uh in the credit card program that um

[37:08] card program that um is a benefit that people think they're

[37:10] is a benefit that people think they're going to use but end up not using

[37:12] going to use but end up not using um you know much much like the vouchers

[37:14] um you know much much like the vouchers that you get from all the programs is

[37:15] that you get from all the programs is that you know sure it looks good i've

[37:16] that you know sure it looks good i've got 30 vouchers in my

[37:18] got 30 vouchers in my or e-credits in my account but you know

[37:20] or e-credits in my account but you know i don't fly them or use them so

[37:22] i don't fly them or use them so really when you get the mental pressure

[37:23] really when you get the mental pressure i've got to spend more money than i

[37:25] i've got to spend more money than i intended and travel i didn't

[37:27] intended and travel i didn't then just they feel like i'm relieved

[37:29] then just they feel like i'm relieved that i've used them

[37:30] that i've used them that's right exactly so yeah i mean i

[37:32] that's right exactly so yeah i mean i had an interesting history and

[37:34] had an interesting history and ultimately

[37:35] ultimately the reason i left um to come to this uh

[37:37] the reason i left um to come to this uh to worley who i work for now

[37:39] to worley who i work for now is that um i saw the writing on the wall

[37:42] is that um i saw the writing on the wall in that

[37:43] in that um you know some of the things i was

[37:45] um you know some of the things i was trying to do in terms of revamping the

[37:46] trying to do in terms of revamping the member exclusive program to make it more

[37:48] member exclusive program to make it more lucrative

[37:50] lucrative i saw it hitting brick walls all the

[37:52] i saw it hitting brick walls all the time and i didn't see

[37:55] time and i didn't see the vision of it being realized for two

[37:58] the vision of it being realized for two three four five years and i just i

[38:01] three four five years and i just i couldn't sit idly by as i knew that the

[38:03] couldn't sit idly by as i knew that the program

[38:04] program was you know going turning uh downwards

[38:07] was you know going turning uh downwards and i didn't want to be um responsible

[38:10] and i didn't want to be um responsible for it

[38:10] for it uh you know as it got eaten up because i

[38:13] uh you know as it got eaten up because i knew

[38:14] knew air canada was going to be relaunching

[38:15] air canada was going to be relaunching their program and i knew that they were

[38:17] their program and i knew that they were going to make some

[38:18] going to make some uh interesting uh additions to their

[38:20] uh interesting uh additions to their their program to make it more

[38:22] their program to make it more palatable and interesting to people or

[38:24] palatable and interesting to people or canadians

[38:25] canadians um and and so ultimately um

[38:28] um and and so ultimately um i just i didn't see a path forward there

[38:30] i just i didn't see a path forward there and decided that uh you know i

[38:32] and decided that uh you know i should get out and um well number one

[38:35] should get out and um well number one you may

[38:35] you may may or not know may or may not know but

[38:37] may or not know may or may not know but the airline industry does not pay well

[38:39] the airline industry does not pay well um at all and so i actually took a fifty

[38:42] um at all and so i actually took a fifty percent pay cut to go to area to westjet

[38:44] percent pay cut to go to area to westjet um and so now that i'm back in the

[38:47] um and so now that i'm back in the industry i figured that

[38:48] industry i figured that um rather than change the program from

[38:51] um rather than change the program from within um

[38:52] within um you know i'll just earn extra money and

[38:53] you know i'll just earn extra money and fly whoever it was

[38:55] fly whoever it was [Laughter]

[38:59] that last one just curious uh

[39:03] that last one just curious uh your your prediction and people are

[39:05] your your prediction and people are calling the death of airline alliances

[39:07] calling the death of airline alliances up until this year

[39:08] up until this year and then it's joint ventures it's deep

[39:10] and then it's joint ventures it's deep investment and then the travel

[39:12] investment and then the travel industry has this massive collapse with

[39:15] industry has this massive collapse with the pandemic and i'm wondering is uh

[39:18] the pandemic and i'm wondering is uh you know it is an alliance is sky team

[39:21] you know it is an alliance is sky team in the future for westjet

[39:23] in the future for westjet is it just hang out in the delta joint

[39:25] is it just hang out in the delta joint venture is it going alone more

[39:26] venture is it going alone more partnerships what what is an airline

[39:28] partnerships what what is an airline like westjet that

[39:29] like westjet that has growth ambitions do in the current

[39:32] has growth ambitions do in the current environment

[39:33] environment well i can tell you that um when when i

[39:35] well i can tell you that um when when i took over the program

[39:36] took over the program uh there was an intent to actually

[39:38] uh there was an intent to actually launch three new partners

[39:39] launch three new partners uh and i can't tell you who those were

[39:41] uh and i can't tell you who those were but uh

[39:43] but uh uh the intent was to grow by two or

[39:45] uh the intent was to grow by two or three partners every year uh

[39:47] three partners every year uh and i did talk to um the network

[39:50] and i did talk to um the network guys uh and uh the the guys that

[39:53] guys uh and uh the the guys that held the strong the partnership

[39:55] held the strong the partnership relationships uh with

[39:57] relationships uh with with our current partners which were

[39:58] with our current partners which were delta air france klm and qantas

[40:01] delta air france klm and qantas and i asked the question uh because that

[40:04] and i asked the question uh because that that is um

[40:05] that is um you know typically uh people are are

[40:08] you know typically uh people are are often speculating that westjet

[40:10] often speculating that westjet is kind of ideal to join sky team

[40:12] is kind of ideal to join sky team especially with a strong jv with delta

[40:14] especially with a strong jv with delta um and i asked that question and the

[40:16] um and i asked that question and the response back from the guy who led that

[40:18] response back from the guy who led that group was that

[40:19] group was that um never in a million years are we gonna

[40:21] um never in a million years are we gonna join an alliance um

[40:23] join an alliance um and so i i kind of got a sense from that

[40:26] and so i i kind of got a sense from that conversation that

[40:27] conversation that uh i think the days of alliances um

[40:31] uh i think the days of alliances um growing and adding more members uh are

[40:34] growing and adding more members uh are probably

[40:34] probably long gone i think that jv's and

[40:37] long gone i think that jv's and partnerships are probably the way

[40:38] partnerships are probably the way they're going to work in the future i

[40:40] they're going to work in the future i think there's just

[40:41] think there's just there's just more flexibility um with

[40:44] there's just more flexibility um with the airline being able to set their own

[40:45] the airline being able to set their own rules and and

[40:46] rules and and work with whomever they want as a

[40:49] work with whomever they want as a partner rather than

[40:51] partner rather than joining an alliance and kind of being

[40:52] joining an alliance and kind of being very uh restricted in what you can and

[40:55] very uh restricted in what you can and can't do

[40:56] can't do uh and you know i don't know for certain

[40:58] uh and you know i don't know for certain but you know i get a sense that

[40:59] but you know i get a sense that you know as you join an alliance uh

[41:02] you know as you join an alliance uh you're kind of the low man on the totem

[41:03] you're kind of the low man on the totem pole you don't get to make a whole lot

[41:05] pole you don't get to make a whole lot of decisions and you may have a vote

[41:07] of decisions and you may have a vote but the founding members typically are

[41:09] but the founding members typically are the ones that end up making the

[41:10] the ones that end up making the decisions

[41:11] decisions uh and you kind of have to fall in line

[41:13] uh and you kind of have to fall in line with it and um you know that

[41:15] with it and um you know that i'm sure the the financial structures

[41:16] i'm sure the the financial structures are not always the most conducive to

[41:19] are not always the most conducive to small airlines

[41:20] small airlines uh and so you know i just i can't see

[41:23] uh and so you know i just i can't see uh westjet ever joining an alliance uh

[41:26] uh westjet ever joining an alliance uh for that reason and many others

[41:27] for that reason and many others um but you know having a strong jv

[41:30] um but you know having a strong jv partnership

[41:31] partnership um with delta is was a top priority

[41:34] um with delta is was a top priority and i do know that the intent was to

[41:37] and i do know that the intent was to have

[41:38] have uh westjet join in another strong

[41:41] uh westjet join in another strong jv partnership with another

[41:44] jv partnership with another airline that controlled a region like

[41:47] airline that controlled a region like europe for example so

[41:48] europe for example so maybe it was klm or air france or that

[41:51] maybe it was klm or air france or that that

[41:52] that group of group of companies but

[41:55] group of group of companies but essentially

[41:56] essentially i think their intent was to establish

[41:59] i think their intent was to establish strong jv partnerships uh

[42:01] strong jv partnerships uh on the continents that they wanted to

[42:03] on the continents that they wanted to travel or wanted to have connections

[42:04] travel or wanted to have connections into

[42:05] into rather than join an alliance um

[42:08] rather than join an alliance um that's that's a disconnect i feel as a

[42:11] that's that's a disconnect i feel as a traveler where

[42:12] traveler where yeah i round the world i know what

[42:14] yeah i round the world i know what stargold is i know what sky priority is

[42:16] stargold is i know what sky priority is i'm a delta diamond i don't have a clue

[42:18] i'm a delta diamond i don't have a clue what i'm getting on uh westjet and it

[42:20] what i'm getting on uh westjet and it certainly wasn't

[42:21] certainly wasn't selection but the audience has been

[42:24] selection but the audience has been patiently waiting for

[42:26] patiently waiting for uh aeroplan okay great shaver traveler

[42:30] uh aeroplan okay great shaver traveler century club canada he's he had a

[42:31] century club canada he's he had a marketing background in shock

[42:33] marketing background in shock uh that bean counter is in charge of a

[42:35] uh that bean counter is in charge of a consumer marketing program uh

[42:37] consumer marketing program uh air canada elite since 89 he's redeemed

[42:40] air canada elite since 89 he's redeemed over five million miles he

[42:42] over five million miles he tried westjet for the first time in 2019

[42:45] tried westjet for the first time in 2019 pretty good for

[42:46] pretty good for one hour flights but he's very curious

[42:49] one hour flights but he's very curious what do you think of the new air canada

[42:51] what do you think of the new air canada aeroplan program

[42:52] aeroplan program especially for elite super elite members

[42:55] especially for elite super elite members this is launching in november yeah i

[42:58] this is launching in november yeah i mean for

[42:59] mean for elite and super elites i i mean i'm i'm

[43:02] elite and super elites i i mean i'm i'm a 50k member

[43:03] a 50k member uh of air canada and i have to say that

[43:06] uh of air canada and i have to say that um you know someone that has seen both

[43:09] um you know someone that has seen both sides and understands

[43:10] sides and understands why air canada and aeroplane are doing

[43:12] why air canada and aeroplane are doing this

[43:13] this i i'm actually struggling to understand

[43:18] i i'm actually struggling to understand the value that you're going to receive

[43:20] the value that you're going to receive as a top tier member

[43:22] as a top tier member with the eric air canada and aero plan

[43:25] with the eric air canada and aero plan i think that you know a lot of the

[43:27] i think that you know a lot of the benefits that you

[43:28] benefits that you would normally covet as a top tier

[43:31] would normally covet as a top tier member

[43:32] member like lounge access and

[43:35] like lounge access and same day change and all those kinds of

[43:37] same day change and all those kinds of things

[43:38] things they're all going to be available for um

[43:42] they're all going to be available for um what i believe is a 600 credit card

[43:45] what i believe is a 600 credit card annual fee credit card so realistically

[43:49] annual fee credit card so realistically you can't get into um the

[43:52] you can't get into um the uh the international lounges uh for air

[43:55] uh the international lounges uh for air canada and the maple leaf lounges until

[43:57] canada and the maple leaf lounges until you're i believe 35k

[43:59] you're i believe 35k um but essentially for that 600 credit

[44:01] um but essentially for that 600 credit card

[44:02] card you're you're more into the 50k

[44:04] you're you're more into the 50k territory the benefits of 50k

[44:07] territory the benefits of 50k excuse me so um i think that you know i

[44:10] excuse me so um i think that you know i i would be concerned or i am concerned

[44:12] i would be concerned or i am concerned as an air canada frequent flyer

[44:14] as an air canada frequent flyer that you know people are just going to

[44:15] that you know people are just going to get the credit card and the lounges

[44:17] get the credit card and the lounges um the maple leaf lounges are nice um

[44:20] um the maple leaf lounges are nice um but they were already crowded um the top

[44:22] but they were already crowded um the top there's quite a few top tier members

[44:24] there's quite a few top tier members with any care in in canada

[44:26] with any care in in canada that are part of the program that have

[44:27] that are part of the program that have lounge access and now

[44:29] lounge access and now um as you can imagine as as this you

[44:32] um as you can imagine as as this you know

[44:33] know sure it's it's an expensive annual fee

[44:35] sure it's it's an expensive annual fee credit card but if you're getting lounge

[44:37] credit card but if you're getting lounge access

[44:37] access if you're getting uh you know priority

[44:40] if you're getting uh you know priority baggage you're getting priority

[44:41] baggage you're getting priority security you're getting uh front of line

[44:43] security you're getting uh front of line service at the counters

[44:45] service at the counters you're getting same day change you know

[44:48] you're getting same day change you know if you're doing that what what's the

[44:50] if you're doing that what what's the benefit of uh

[44:51] benefit of uh flying air canada i mean they do have a

[44:53] flying air canada i mean they do have a few things that are interesting

[44:54] few things that are interesting uh in the program uh like uh you can

[44:57] uh in the program uh like uh you can convey your benefits uh through a

[44:59] convey your benefits uh through a certificate to a friend or family member

[45:01] certificate to a friend or family member and show them what it's like to be a top

[45:02] and show them what it's like to be a top tier member

[45:03] tier member again you know if that person just got

[45:05] again you know if that person just got the credit card they get the same thing

[45:07] the credit card they get the same thing um but they do have uh um

[45:10] um but they do have uh um you know 50 reduction on aeroplan uh

[45:13] you know 50 reduction on aeroplan uh redemptions

[45:14] redemptions uh you get us you'll get a certificate

[45:16] uh you get us you'll get a certificate uh to depending on what level you're at

[45:19] uh to depending on what level you're at you'll get a certain number of

[45:20] you'll get a certain number of certificates

[45:21] certificates um and it means that you can redeem for

[45:24] um and it means that you can redeem for you know say for example you wanted to

[45:25] you know say for example you wanted to go to um

[45:27] go to um i don't know from vancouver to to new

[45:30] i don't know from vancouver to to new york

[45:30] york the same example i've always been using

[45:32] the same example i've always been using um with the top tier member you can

[45:34] um with the top tier member you can redeem a certificate and if

[45:36] redeem a certificate and if if that round trip was say um i don't

[45:39] if that round trip was say um i don't know sixty seventy thousand dollars in

[45:40] know sixty seventy thousand dollars in business class

[45:42] business class i'm sorry points in business class um

[45:44] i'm sorry points in business class um you can redeem that voucher for 50

[45:46] you can redeem that voucher for 50 off which is which is nice but um you

[45:48] off which is which is nice but um you know i think it it

[45:49] know i think it it it still doesn't address the fact that

[45:52] it still doesn't address the fact that um you're losing you you become less

[45:54] um you're losing you you become less elite i guess you would say and i think

[45:56] elite i guess you would say and i think that you know stefan you you're a

[45:58] that you know stefan you you're a frequent flyer

[45:59] frequent flyer and and i remember when i got my first

[46:03] and and i remember when i got my first status

[46:03] status and how proud i was that status and how

[46:06] and how proud i was that status and how hard i had to work that status

[46:08] hard i had to work that status um and now knowing that you know some

[46:11] um and now knowing that you know some some joe blow

[46:12] some joe blow who never flew a day in his life with

[46:14] who never flew a day in his life with air canada now has a 600

[46:16] air canada now has a 600 credit card and can now get all the

[46:18] credit card and can now get all the benefits that i earn

[46:20] benefits that i earn i think i'd be i'd be pretty peeved i

[46:22] i think i'd be i'd be pretty peeved i mean i i think i might

[46:23] mean i i think i might kick myself for making the mistake of

[46:25] kick myself for making the mistake of flying that much uh and

[46:26] flying that much uh and and rather would have just gotten the

[46:27] and rather would have just gotten the credit card so i think you know

[46:30] credit card so i think you know it'll be interesting because they've

[46:31] it'll be interesting because they've when they launched the program they said

[46:32] when they launched the program they said they're

[46:33] they're they've they've told us about 60 of what

[46:35] they've they've told us about 60 of what the program is

[46:37] the program is so it'll be interesting if the remaining

[46:38] so it'll be interesting if the remaining 40 is more concentrated on showing um

[46:42] 40 is more concentrated on showing um some love to the the top tier members

[46:44] some love to the the top tier members within air canada

[46:45] within air canada um because that right now i have

[46:47] um because that right now i have significant concerns about um

[46:49] significant concerns about um uh the elites and and how how you meet

[46:52] uh the elites and and how how you meet the feel as a top tier member especially

[46:53] the feel as a top tier member especially if you're

[46:54] if you're going to the the the uh the lounge and

[46:57] going to the the the uh the lounge and you're seeing like

[46:57] you're seeing like you know it even more crowded than it

[46:59] you know it even more crowded than it already is uh and

[47:01] already is uh and uh you know and and couple that with the

[47:03] uh you know and and couple that with the fact that kovit is has taken away

[47:05] fact that kovit is has taken away the the uh you know a la carte food and

[47:09] the the uh you know a la carte food and now your bag lunch and now it's like you

[47:11] now your bag lunch and now it's like you know it's it's almost not even worth

[47:13] know it's it's almost not even worth going to the lounge anymore so

[47:15] going to the lounge anymore so it's it's interesting that they've gone

[47:17] it's it's interesting that they've gone that direction

[47:18] that direction um but you know the the side of me that

[47:20] um but you know the the side of me that sees the airline side

[47:22] sees the airline side understands that um why they're doing it

[47:25] understands that um why they're doing it and it

[47:25] and it is to attract more people into the

[47:27] is to attract more people into the program and uh

[47:28] program and uh um you know again it's back to that

[47:30] um you know again it's back to that virtuous cycle if you have that 600

[47:32] virtuous cycle if you have that 600 credit card

[47:33] credit card you see how well you're treated with

[47:34] you see how well you're treated with that benefit and maybe you want to earn

[47:36] that benefit and maybe you want to earn it for yourself legitimately

[47:38] it for yourself legitimately maybe you want to be 100k but even if

[47:41] maybe you want to be 100k but even if you don't

[47:41] you don't um you sign up for that credit card and

[47:44] um you sign up for that credit card and they have

[47:44] they have uh you know contracts with their

[47:46] uh you know contracts with their financial partners uh to

[47:48] financial partners uh to to have kickbacks on on people that sign

[47:50] to have kickbacks on on people that sign up for the credit cards and for every

[47:52] up for the credit cards and for every at least at westjet you know we we got a

[47:54] at least at westjet you know we we got a percentage of every dollar spent on the

[47:55] percentage of every dollar spent on the credit card

[47:56] credit card uh back as part of our partnership

[47:58] uh back as part of our partnership agreement and so

[48:00] agreement and so you know if you can get more people in

[48:01] you know if you can get more people in the credit card and they're spending

[48:02] the credit card and they're spending money on that credit cards the first uh

[48:04] money on that credit cards the first uh top of wallet credit card

[48:05] top of wallet credit card um then you're going to earn a lot of

[48:06] um then you're going to earn a lot of money for for

[48:09] money for for your program and potentially that means

[48:11] your program and potentially that means that as you earn more and more of that

[48:13] that as you earn more and more of that revenue potentially you can do

[48:15] revenue potentially you can do special things for people that are

[48:17] special things for people that are legitimately in your top tier

[48:19] legitimately in your top tier your membership right maybe that means

[48:21] your membership right maybe that means um you know

[48:22] um you know i know that uh in the past they had

[48:24] i know that uh in the past they had given they had a contest

[48:26] given they had a contest to give somebody a lease for a bmw for a

[48:28] to give somebody a lease for a bmw for a year uh that

[48:29] year uh that someone who won a contest with their

[48:31] someone who won a contest with their canada maybe they start doing more and

[48:33] canada maybe they start doing more and more of those kinds of things right

[48:35] more of those kinds of things right and and really showing them love but

[48:37] and and really showing them love but currently and it's it's current

[48:38] currently and it's it's current iteration i have

[48:39] iteration i have deep concerns about uh how some of these

[48:41] deep concerns about uh how some of these people might be feeling the top in in

[48:43] people might be feeling the top in in air canada's top tier uh elites yeah

[48:46] air canada's top tier uh elites yeah exactly how thrilled i am when a delta

[48:48] exactly how thrilled i am when a delta reserve card holder gets a

[48:50] reserve card holder gets a i breaker on the upgrade list yep but

[48:54] i breaker on the upgrade list yep but i love i love that move yeah

[48:57] i love i love that move yeah and ultimate 100 had like this i just

[49:00] and ultimate 100 had like this i just thought when i heard it it was like the

[49:02] thought when i heard it it was like the ultimate frequent flyer benefit the

[49:05] ultimate frequent flyer benefit the instead of this 50 off whatever the

[49:07] instead of this 50 off whatever the price might be which the price could be

[49:09] price might be which the price could be extremely high right the

[49:10] extremely high right the altitude 100s currently have these what

[49:13] altitude 100s currently have these what is it eight

[49:14] is it eight eight awards a year that they can get at

[49:16] eight awards a year that they can get at the standard award chart price no matter

[49:18] the standard award chart price no matter as long as there's a

[49:20] as long as there's a revenue bill for sale yeah

[49:23] revenue bill for sale yeah and that yes air canada had something

[49:25] and that yes air canada had something similar um

[49:26] similar um and it was called ikk

[49:29] and it was called ikk and uh it basically meant that you could

[49:32] and uh it basically meant that you could you could use

[49:33] you could use i think you had a certain number i

[49:35] i think you had a certain number i didn't have any myself

[49:37] didn't have any myself um but uh you had a certain number that

[49:39] um but uh you had a certain number that you could uh yeah basically call your

[49:41] you could uh yeah basically call your concierge you want to redeem this

[49:42] concierge you want to redeem this this certificate and uh yeah get get a

[49:45] this certificate and uh yeah get get a standard redemption for any seat that

[49:48] standard redemption for any seat that was available on the flight as long as

[49:49] was available on the flight as long as there was one seat left

[49:51] there was one seat left see that to me feels as a frequent flyer

[49:54] see that to me feels as a frequent flyer that

[49:54] that to me even if i paid maybe more miles on

[49:57] to me even if i paid maybe more miles on average

[49:58] average that feels like a better benefit than a

[50:00] that feels like a better benefit than a 50 off voucher

[50:01] 50 off voucher yeah i agree i think that um you know

[50:04] yeah i agree i think that um you know typically if you're using that you're

[50:06] typically if you're using that you're you're kind of in a situation where you

[50:09] you're kind of in a situation where you need it right you like you're not

[50:11] need it right you like you're not if if you need to get to a funeral or or

[50:13] if if you need to get to a funeral or or something or wedding and last minute

[50:15] something or wedding and last minute thing

[50:16] thing um having that ability to take snatch up

[50:19] um having that ability to take snatch up that last seat

[50:20] that last seat uh and not put money out of your pocket

[50:22] uh and not put money out of your pocket for it

[50:23] for it um that's a nice feeling but you know

[50:27] um that's a nice feeling but you know you know you still need award inventory

[50:29] you know you still need award inventory uh for the well

[50:31] uh for the well so the new eric air canada program has

[50:34] so the new eric air canada program has just the classic which is award

[50:35] just the classic which is award inventory and then you can also do

[50:37] inventory and then you can also do uh the revenue pricing and that

[50:39] uh the revenue pricing and that certificate still gives you 50

[50:40] certificate still gives you 50 off um both both types um

[50:43] off um both both types um but you know when you're in that

[50:45] but you know when you're in that situation where you need that last

[50:46] situation where you need that last minute seat

[50:47] minute seat i don't know that you're really carrying

[50:49] i don't know that you're really carrying um about

[50:51] um about 50 back i think you just want the seat

[50:53] 50 back i think you just want the seat at the regular

[50:54] at the regular fair the the regular redemption rate uh

[50:57] fair the the regular redemption rate uh rather than have to dig

[50:58] rather than have to dig in and say okay it feels vip it's just

[51:01] in and say okay it feels vip it's just like

[51:01] like yeah that's in your mind boom you know

[51:06] yeah so yeah i was i mean i think that

[51:09] yeah so yeah i was i mean i think that um

[51:10] um uh the the idea that you can just say to

[51:14] uh the the idea that you can just say to anybody hey

[51:14] anybody hey uh i can i can get any seat i want in

[51:17] uh i can i can get any seat i want in there in canada all i have to do is you

[51:18] there in canada all i have to do is you know as a top remember i

[51:20] know as a top remember i flopped down the certificate and i'm

[51:22] flopped down the certificate and i'm paying uh

[51:23] paying uh you know this this last minute seat to

[51:26] you know this this last minute seat to hawaii at christmas

[51:27] hawaii at christmas i'm paying 40 000 points a return like

[51:31] i'm paying 40 000 points a return like can you do that because i can do that

[51:33] can you do that because i can do that because i'm a top tier member

[51:36] because i'm a top tier member and uh rick saying given the program has

[51:38] and uh rick saying given the program has been repatriated by an airline rather

[51:40] been repatriated by an airline rather than a loyalty company we've been

[51:42] than a loyalty company we've been promised they will look

[51:43] promised they will look after top tier flyers only makes sense

[51:46] after top tier flyers only makes sense so

[51:46] so i'm not sure if he's optimistic and then

[51:49] i'm not sure if he's optimistic and then anthony's saying uh so do you also need

[51:52] anthony's saying uh so do you also need to spend 6 000 cash on ac

[51:53] to spend 6 000 cash on ac flights to keep your 50k or can you just

[51:56] flights to keep your 50k or can you just i guess

[51:57] i guess so he's thinking you get it just with

[51:58] so he's thinking you get it just with their new premier credit cards i think

[51:59] their new premier credit cards i think your point is that

[52:01] your point is that you're not getting the actual status

[52:02] you're not getting the actual status with the credit card but you're getting

[52:04] with the credit card but you're getting kind of benefits that are so similar

[52:05] kind of benefits that are so similar it's just as

[52:06] it's just as exact exactly yeah so um

[52:09] exact exactly yeah so um yeah the benefits are priority security

[52:12] yeah the benefits are priority security priority baggage

[52:13] priority baggage priority check-in uh and lounge access

[52:16] priority check-in uh and lounge access and same day change and so

[52:19] and same day change and so those are all benefits that you would

[52:22] those are all benefits that you would get roughly at the 50k

[52:23] get roughly at the 50k level um and you know

[52:27] level um and you know again you don't get the you don't get

[52:29] again you don't get the you don't get the bag tag you don't get the

[52:31] the bag tag you don't get the welcome letter from uh so but