# Tuesday Talks 2026 - Behind the Curtain: Mythbusting Holistic Review

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4taRDOUoq5M
Translation: zh-CN

[00:00] campus, our fictional campus, um, and

[00:02] collaboration and teamwork.

[00:04] And then for the next slide, um, you

[00:07] know, I'll introduce this topic of

[00:08] holistic admission. So, you'll hear this

[00:10] word a lot as you go through the

[00:11] application process, but specifically

[00:13] for us, it really means that we're

[00:15] weighing all of these factors and they

[00:17] all have something to do with our

[00:18] decision. Um, so you can see this

[00:20] graphic here. Really all three of those

[00:22] areas are things that we're considering

[00:24] in our final decision. We'll go through

[00:25] each of them kind of as we go, um, and

[00:27] so your your ideas might change as you

[00:29] start to weigh all of these factors

[00:31] together. Um, but you know, this very

[00:33] much mirrors what we're doing, um, you

[00:35] know, on our campuses, um, each year

[00:37] with our applicant pools. So, I think we

[00:39] were all ready to head to the next

[00:40] slide.

[00:44] I can just go in and start talking about

[00:46] our first candidate here. So, that would

[00:48] be Ishaan. Um, and so Ishaan is a

[00:51] Chinese citizen living in China for his

[00:52] whole life. Um, his native tongue is

[00:55] Chinese. Both of his parents have

[00:56] bachelor's degrees and currently he's

[00:58] senior, uh, in his senior year attending

[01:01] school curriculum school in Beijing,

[01:02] China.

[01:04] Amazing. Um, so,

[01:07] uh, you know, each of us is going to,

[01:08] um, sort of focus on one single student

[01:10] so you can remember our voices tied to

[01:12] the student. Um, I'm going to be be

[01:14] talking about our friend Anne. Uh, she's

[01:15] a Canadian citizen living in in a small

[01:17] rural location in Canada her most of her

[01:19] life. However, right now she's in her

[01:21] senior year at a boarding school in

[01:22] India. She transferred there in 11th

[01:24] grade from a public school that she was

[01:26] in in Canada. Uh, both parents have high

[01:28] school diplomas but neither of them went

[01:29] to college making her a first generation

[01:32] to college student.

[01:34] Great. Um, and I am really excited to

[01:37] tell you a bit more about David. Uh,

[01:39] you'll see here David was born in

[01:42] Chicago in the United States and moved

[01:44] to Singapore at the age of three where

[01:46] he's lived since. Both of his parents

[01:49] graduated with a bachelor's degree and

[01:51] his mom has an advanced degree as a, um,

[01:53] an MBA.

[01:55] And currently he's in a senior year at

[01:57] an international school in Singapore.

[01:59] We're going to go to the next slide

[02:01] because you're probably looking for some

[02:03] more information, right? And so now, as

[02:05] Jackie mentioned, right, we're talking a

[02:07] little bit about the academic component.

[02:10] Then you'll hear a little bit about who

[02:12] students are outside the classroom. And

[02:14] then the last slide that you'll get to

[02:15] see from these students is about that

[02:17] sort of like institutional fit,

[02:18] institutional priorities. Um so yeah,

[02:20] I'll turn things back to Jackie to tell

[02:21] you a little bit more about

[02:24] the academic experience.

[02:26] Sure, yeah. So for Ishaan, her academic

[02:28] experience is based in that national

[02:30] curriculum, but she has been or he he,

[02:32] sorry. He has been able to take some AP

[02:36] classes along with the national

[02:37] curriculum. And those AP classes are AP

[02:39] physics, economics, calculus, French

[02:41] language, English language and

[02:43] literature.

[02:44] Next up for grades, so we're looking in

[02:47] ninth grade, it was a mix of mostly B's

[02:49] and some A's. In 10th and 11th grade, he

[02:51] had a mix of A's and A pluses. So we're

[02:53] seeing a bit of an upward trend there,

[02:54] but there is still there are some B's in

[02:57] French. Um so that might be a slight

[02:59] point of weakness for him there. But

[03:01] overall GPA is a 4.05. So we're looking

[03:03] at a pretty strong student overall. And

[03:06] Ishaan decided not to take the essay or

[03:08] not to submit SAT or ACT scores. So

[03:10] that's not something we're going to be

[03:11] thinking about in the process for

[03:13] Ishaan. And I will turn it over to Joe

[03:15] to speak about Ann.

[03:17] Thank you, Jackie.

[03:19] So as for Ann, we have again a

[03:21] transition in curriculum and school

[03:23] since she transferred to her residential

[03:26] boarding school in India in 11th grade.

[03:30] In the IB curriculum she's currently in

[03:31] the IB curriculum, but she did her first

[03:33] two years in of high school in a

[03:35] Canadian curriculum. You can see the IB

[03:37] courses that she's taken there.

[03:39] If you don't know the IB, you take three

[03:41] courses in the high level, three courses

[03:43] in the standard level across two years.

[03:45] So these are going to be repeated

[03:46] courses for the two year span.

[03:49] And the grading is in a seven point

[03:51] scale. Six and sevens being more like

[03:53] A's, five being a B, four a C, three a

[03:56] D, and so on, roughly speaking. Um so,

[03:59] you can see here uh for Anne's grades,

[04:02] um she had all A's in ninth and 10th

[04:04] grade. Uh but but she had a pretty

[04:05] significant dip in 11th grade uh when

[04:08] she transferred to this boarding school.

[04:09] She got a three or a D in French, a four

[04:13] in history, a five in marine biology,

[04:16] and the rest have been sixes and sevens.

[04:19] Um

[04:19] She gets predicted the IB diploma allows

[04:22] us to get a predicted score what the

[04:23] school expects the student to get in

[04:25] their final exams. We get a predicted

[04:27] grade of 36 out of 45, um which is okay,

[04:31] um but it could be stronger for sure. Um

[04:35] as for testing though, we have an SAT of

[04:37] 1520 that she submitted, which is a

[04:39] strong testing for her. Uh so, 770 in

[04:42] math, 750 in English.

[04:46] Okay, great. I'm excited to share a

[04:48] little bit more about David's academic

[04:50] trajectory. Uh you'll see here he's in

[04:52] an advanced placement curriculum, also

[04:54] known as APs. Um and he will complete 11

[04:58] AP courses um by the time he graduates

[05:01] with over half of them being in 12th

[05:03] grade. Um so, um that is a a really

[05:06] rigorous and demanding uh course load,

[05:10] no doubt. We see that his grades,

[05:13] there's a high school grading scale of

[05:15] A's and B's, so he's um had a mix of A's

[05:18] and B's in ninth through 11th.

[05:21] But we'll see that there's a slight

[05:22] upward trajectory. In 12th grade, we

[05:24] have first semester grades, um and in

[05:27] those six advanced placement courses,

[05:29] he's got four A's and two B's. Um so,

[05:33] that's really exciting to see that uh in

[05:35] his most rigorous curriculum yet likely,

[05:37] um he's doing his best work.

[05:39] We also see that David chose not to

[05:42] submit the SAT or ACT, but did choose to

[05:45] self-report um

[05:47] from those

[05:48] AP courses he took before 12th grade, a

[05:51] mix of fours and fives on those AP

[05:53] exams. So, up to us in the admission

[05:55] committee to determine whether or not

[05:57] that's something that we think is

[05:58] helpful.

[05:59] All right. So, now you've gotten sort of

[06:02] a first look at these three students.

[06:05] And I know you're hungry for more

[06:07] information, but just to get sort of a

[06:08] temperature check, it'd be really great

[06:10] to know who you are most compelled by

[06:13] with the academic and some of the

[06:15] personal information that we have. So,

[06:17] please select one of these students that

[06:20] you would like to vote to admit. And

[06:22] it'd be awesome in the chat to hear a

[06:24] little bit about who you're most

[06:26] compelled by and why. And again, if

[06:29] questions are coming up for you, please

[06:30] put them in the Q&A and we'll be excited

[06:32] to get to them in a little bit.

[06:40] I always feel like this is a great drum

[06:41] roll moment. I know it can be

[06:44] challenging to make a decision, but at

[06:47] this moment, I promise you'll get more

[06:48] information. Just helpful for us to know

[06:51] who is resonating most strongly with you

[06:53] now.

[06:55] Yeah, right now we have 40% of you have

[06:57] participated. So,

[06:59] So, we would love to see a little bit

[07:01] higher participation so we can kind of

[07:03] get a good representation.

[07:05] Let's get to that 50%.

[07:08] Juniors, I'm looking at you. This is a

[07:10] great way to step into this process.

[07:16] Somebody said, "So hard to make a

[07:17] choice." Yeah. Yes. I understand that

[07:20] for sure.

[07:21] >> We're we're wanting you to

[07:23] get a taste of what it's like for these

[07:26] poor admissions officers who have to

[07:27] read so many applications

[07:30] of many, many strong students.

[07:33] Um okay, maybe we'll give it like

[07:36] 10 more seconds. If you don't see the

[07:38] poll, you got to look on your Zoom.

[07:41] They might There might be like a little

[07:43] notification.

[07:46] Um

[07:48] All right.

[07:50] 10

[07:51] 9 [laughter]

[07:53] 8

[07:54] 7 6 5 4 3 2 1 All right. We have 40%

[08:03] wanting E-shun

[08:04] and 26% saying Ann and 34% saying David.

[08:11] All right. Thanks, Gloria. Um what a

[08:13] great great spread. There's advocacy

[08:15] across these three candidates. All

[08:17] right. Well, I know you want to learn

[08:19] more, so let's talk a little bit more

[08:20] about how students are engaging in their

[08:22] communities.

[08:24] You're getting a sense of how tough this

[08:26] is. Okay, it's only going to get more

[08:27] difficult from here.

[08:29] >> [laughter]

[08:29] >> Um okay, so E-shun is a four-year tennis

[08:32] athlete and captain of the tennis team.

[08:34] So, some nice leadership there and some

[08:36] consistency. Can really see the passion

[08:38] for tennis. Uh but, he's also a a member

[08:40] of the cooking club, has had multiple

[08:42] finance internships, and takes care of

[08:44] his younger sibling. So, a very

[08:45] well-rounded resume there. Next [snorts]

[08:47] up, um for E-shun's essay, uh he writes

[08:50] about his love of beverages and his

[08:51] journey experimenting with his own

[08:53] concoctions. Uh we learn that he's

[08:55] persistent and enjoys applying his

[08:57] knowledge to practice. And then finally,

[09:00] um from his recommendation letter, so

[09:01] typically we see some teacher

[09:03] recommendations and a counselor

[09:04] recommendation, um we see that he's in

[09:06] the top 1% of his class. His counselor

[09:09] describes him as caring and candid. He

[09:11] goes the extra mile to learn and is

[09:13] highly engaged in community projects.

[09:16] Next up, we'll talk about Ann.

[09:19] Yeah, so for Ann, her biggest

[09:21] participation is in the karate, uh being

[09:23] a karate competitor. As and she's

[09:25] actually part of the national team uh

[09:26] and also an assistant coach. Uh she's

[09:28] also part of competitive theater improv,

[09:30] something that I didn't know existed

[09:31] until I read her application, but fun to

[09:33] see.

[09:34] Uh she works part-time as a dance

[09:36] instructor and she's doing research in

[09:38] marine biology, but with an advocacy and

[09:40] policy work and she's part of some clubs

[09:42] in high school. Um, her essay is a

[09:44] deeper dive into what she's learned from

[09:46] karate and seeing it not only as a

[09:48] sport, but as a lifestyle and

[09:50] understanding all about dedication,

[09:52] failure, teamwork and leadership through

[09:54] the sport.

[09:55] Um, her recommendations give us a lot of

[09:57] context and they're really uh upfront

[09:59] about how she really initially struggled

[10:01] with the transition to the IB diploma in

[10:04] 11th grade. A much more challenging

[10:05] curriculum than her uh previous uh

[10:08] public high school curriculum in Canada.

[10:10] Um, so that's why she had this

[10:11] significant dip. Uh, but she's used her

[10:12] summer to catch up and is trying to be

[10:15] better.

[10:16] And while she doesn't have a leadership

[10:17] title in sort of anything that she

[10:19] participates in, she's very much a role

[10:21] model in the residential setting and

[10:22] that's how she sort of demonstrates that

[10:24] leadership.

[10:26] Okay, excellent. Um, excited to tell you

[10:29] a bit more about David, who I think

[10:31] really encapsulates this idea of both uh

[10:33] breadth of uh community engagement, but

[10:35] also you'll see some real depth. Um, so

[10:38] David founded a um uh fundraiser and a

[10:42] nonprofit for underpriv- privileged

[10:44] preschoolers um and their fees. He's

[10:46] also teaching English.

[10:48] He is a regional board member for the

[10:50] global youth nonprofit organization,

[10:53] chair of MUN, who doesn't love MUN? Um,

[10:57] he's also had experience as a uh

[11:01] research um assistant at a university

[11:04] looking at uh

[11:06] computer science of AI um and done some

[11:09] data analysis uh internships as well.

[11:13] Uh, busy guy.

[11:14] He writes about supporting a younger

[11:17] peer through a challenging uh social

[11:19] situation and we uh get to see a little

[11:22] bit more about um sort of who he is and

[11:25] what he values. He's uh excited to be a

[11:27] mentor um and wants to really support

[11:30] his younger peers um which in a a lot of

[11:32] ways, really connects nicely to the kind

[11:34] of residential community we're seeking

[11:36] to build at McCollough that.

[11:38] Um, in his recommendation letters, we

[11:41] hear a lot of those same themes come

[11:43] through. There's this clear passion for

[11:45] computer science, for, um, AI and

[11:48] machine learning.

[11:49] Um, and he's thinking a lot about sort

[11:51] of policy implications, um, within, uh,

[11:54] these really important, uh, uh, uh, sort

[11:57] of ideas and topics, um, to all of us.

[12:01] And we also see, just like we, uh, got

[12:03] to hear from him directly about how

[12:05] important it is to be a mentor, um,

[12:07] that's also something that his letters

[12:09] of recommendation really lifted up. And

[12:11] it's wonderful to see that sort of

[12:13] consistency in how, uh, student presents

[12:15] themselves and also, um, you know, the

[12:19] adults in his life, um, are really

[12:21] supporting that. So, um, I, for one, am

[12:24] very excited, uh, about David. And now,

[12:27] um, you choose who you are most excited

[12:30] about, um, who you really see, again,

[12:32] um, not who you like the most, um, or

[12:34] who you see yourself in, um, but

[12:36] thinking about McCollough that and who

[12:38] we are and, uh, what we value as an

[12:40] institution, who you think is going to

[12:42] thrive on our campus, how will they

[12:44] contribute meaningfully to the building

[12:46] of our community, and how will the

[12:48] opportunities and resources we have

[12:49] available, um, allow one of these

[12:51] students to grow in really exciting

[12:53] ways.

[12:55] And I think, as Jackie mentioned, um,

[12:56] probably the decision is just getting

[12:58] harder, so I'm sorry. I hope you have a

[13:01] calming cup of tea,

[13:02] >> [laughter]

[13:03] >> uh, with you. That's certainly important

[13:04] for me as I'm reading applications.

[13:07] Oh. People People started voting faster

[13:10] this time. I don't know if it's because

[13:12] the poll they knew where the poll was

[13:14] now or now they're like, "Okay, now

[13:16] we're in the groove."

[13:18] Excellent.

[13:19] >> but I'm going to give it a little bit

[13:20] more time because we want to get to like

[13:22] a close to the number that voted last

[13:24] time. So, if you voted last time, you

[13:26] definitely want to vote this time, too.

[13:28] See if anything has

[13:29] >> to share why you're voting for for who

[13:31] you're voting for.

[13:32] >> the chat and let us know, you know,

[13:35] yeah, even kind of how you're struggling

[13:37] with it.

[13:41] All righty, we're almost at the number.

[13:43] Come on, I just need two, three more

[13:45] people.

[13:46] >> [laughter]

[13:48] >> Three more people to tell me what you

[13:49] want.

[13:53] All right, guys.

[13:55] All right, 10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2,

[14:03] 1. Okay, 51% want David this time.

[14:07] Uh 23% for Ann and 26% for for Ishaan.

[14:12] So, woo. All right. Some shifting.

[14:16] Exactly. Okay, um and now sort of we'll

[14:20] hear a little bit more about that last

[14:21] piece of the holistic um puzzle that

[14:24] Jackie was talking about, sort of

[14:25] institutional match. So, I'll turn

[14:26] things back to Jackie.

[14:28] Yeah, okay. So, for Ishaan, um the first

[14:31] thing we're thinking about is

[14:31] demonstrated interest. And really that

[14:33] means that it's how you're interacting

[14:35] with the college you're applying to. Um

[14:37] and so, Ishaan has attended three

[14:39] virtual events for McCollbat and

[14:42] submitted an initial view interview that

[14:44] really made him kind of jump off the

[14:46] page and we we kind of understood him as

[14:48] a real person and understood his

[14:49] interests in a real way. Um and in his

[14:51] own voice. And then for a supplemental

[14:54] response, so this is something that was

[14:55] specific again to McCollbat. Um so,

[14:58] Ishaan's why McCollbat supplement um

[15:01] what is somewhat broad and lacked depth,

[15:03] uh pretty generic, authentic voice. So,

[15:06] maybe a little bit more research could

[15:07] have been done, but um we got a sense of

[15:09] of who he was. Um next up, mission

[15:12] alignment. So, again, bringing it back

[15:14] to the mission of the college, how is um

[15:16] Ishaan fitting into that? So, um he

[15:18] really shows a clear dedication to

[15:20] finance with extensive internship

[15:22] experience. So, that speaks to kind of

[15:23] what we're looking for in some of our

[15:25] programs. Um and he can contribute to

[15:27] the tennis team. That's always nice to

[15:29] see.

[15:30] And next up, we'll talk about Ann.

[15:32] Amazing. Um so, I actually met Ann on

[15:34] the road when I went to her high school,

[15:36] and boy oh boy was she a lovely human

[15:39] being. Just the darndest, goodest human

[15:41] being.

[15:43] Um she did not submit an initial view

[15:44] interview or any interview whatsoever,

[15:46] so we didn't get to see her sort of like

[15:48] come alive in the application process,

[15:50] but we did get that interaction at her

[15:52] school. Um her supplemental response,

[15:54] there was a couple of typos. I will

[15:56] admit the the biggest of which was that

[15:58] she wrote "McBulcutt" instead of

[16:00] "McCullough Bat". So, she kind of

[16:01] misspelled the institution. Uh but that

[16:04] aside, she had very gen- a very

[16:06] re-genuine reflection on her interests

[16:08] in uh who we are, and she actually noted

[16:11] specific programs and opportunities that

[16:13] would actually make her thrive and which

[16:14] she would be excited by uh to take a

[16:16] part of here in McCullough Bat. Um as

[16:18] for what we who we see her and how we

[16:20] how she aligns to our mission, we see

[16:22] this very clear interest in pursuing

[16:25] interdisciplinary sciences, and uh also

[16:27] partaking in the politics summer

[16:29] research program that is happening at

[16:31] Washington. And overall through her

[16:33] application, we just saw this beautiful

[16:34] eagerness to becoming a Marauder and

[16:36] being sort of an intentional member of

[16:38] our community.

[16:41] Okay, great. Um as for David, uh David

[16:45] connected with McCullough Bat uh via a

[16:48] virtual alumni interview. Um and we got

[16:51] a sort of report from the alum, which uh

[16:53] really sort of aligned with other pieces

[16:55] of the application um that we that we

[16:58] received already.

[16:59] Um his supplement, he talks openly about

[17:03] using AI. Um and then uh sort of

[17:07] challenges us as the reader uh to sort

[17:10] of think about uh how we feel about his

[17:13] use of AI. So, it was a an interesting

[17:17] uh, take, though didn't really answer

[17:19] the why McCollough that question. Um, so

[17:22] we get a better sense of his

[17:23] intellectual curiosity, perhaps, um, but

[17:26] not maybe a better sense of why he's

[17:28] chosen to apply.

[17:30] Um, and then in terms of mission

[17:32] alignment, we're, um, we're seeing this,

[17:34] you know, really strong interest in

[17:35] computer science, um, and as we talked

[17:38] about a little bit earlier, that strong

[17:40] interest in community building, um, and

[17:42] and being a mentor, um, and we see that

[17:44] aligning really nicely with his

[17:46] residential,

[17:47] uh, with the residential community we're

[17:48] building at McCollough that. Um, I also

[17:52] have the opportunity, I wear two hats in

[17:55] the McCollough that office. I'm not just

[17:57] a, um,

[17:58] an admission officer, but I also serve

[18:00] as the athletics liaison. And Ring,

[18:02] ring. I'm so sorry to be rude here, but

[18:05] I I must take a call from our tennis

[18:08] coach. Um, and I've been told that this

[18:11] is not a phone, but instead this is a

[18:13] phone, so let me [laughter] answer my

[18:15] phone.

[18:17] Oh. Uh, so it seems Nick, our tennis

[18:21] coach, our men's tennis coach, is saying

[18:22] that

[18:23] um, Yuxuan came to him a little bit late

[18:26] in the process, but is someone who they

[18:29] see contributing to the tennis team. Um,

[18:31] maybe not in their first year, but, um,

[18:34] in years two, three, and four, they'd be

[18:35] a really important player for, uh, the

[18:38] men's tennis team, which we know, uh,

[18:40] just got those new courts and is part of

[18:42] some of our other sort of strategic, uh,

[18:44] planning in the athletics realm. So,

[18:46] friends, admissions counselors, uh, do

[18:49] with that what you will.

[18:52] Um, so now we have the sort of

[18:54] impossible choice,

[18:55] >> [laughter]

[18:55] >> um, where you're going to choose one of

[18:58] these really, uh, delightful students to

[19:00] admit, um, the student that you think

[19:02] most closely aligns with the McCollough

[19:04] that mission. You're going to choose one

[19:06] of these students to waitlist. Um, I

[19:08] will say one of the things that's

[19:09] helpful to think about in the waitlist

[19:11] conversation, um, is who do you think is

[19:15] on May 12th or June 12th or sometimes

[19:19] July 12th

[19:20] would be interested [laughter]

[19:21] in saying yes to McCollough bat if they

[19:24] too received a call not from Nick but

[19:27] from one of us about the possibility of

[19:29] joining the class. So that is definitely

[19:32] a key component waitlisted student is

[19:34] someone that we are compelled by but we

[19:36] just don't have the place in the class

[19:38] for them at the moment. So that to

[19:40] consider in the waitlist decision.

[19:43] And then unfortunately at highly

[19:46] selective institutions we deny the vast

[19:49] majority of applicants and that doesn't

[19:51] mean that they weren't incredible

[19:54] in their application but just the

[19:56] reality of not having as many places in

[19:59] the class as we would like. So I'm going

[20:01] to ask you to to take another minute or

[20:03] so

[20:05] make those selections if you are

[20:07] interested in sharing a little bit about

[20:09] why you're voting for who you're voting

[20:12] for in the chat that's awesome. And

[20:16] we'll look forward to the final results.

[20:20] Okay, don't be shy. You guys can discuss

[20:23] on the chat. Please.

[20:25] Yeah.

[20:26] Let's see if anyone is ready on the

[20:28] other platforms saying anything.

[20:32] Um

[20:33] and right now it looks really tight

[20:36] guys.

[20:37] But

[20:38] >> Every vote counts. Every vote counts. So

[20:40] I really really want like if you didn't

[20:42] vote the last few times now is your

[20:43] chance. This is Exercise that right.

[20:47] >> [laughter]

[20:50] >> All right.

[20:51] And while we're waiting for people to

[20:53] vote if Jackie Kat and Joe can you

[20:56] describe for us a little bit of what it

[20:58] is like in the committee room like when

[21:00] you are making a decision is it like a

[21:02] vote like are people raising their hand

[21:04] or how does it work?

[21:08] Gloria, it depends. Uh

[21:10] >> [laughter]

[21:11] >> I know.

[21:13] Uh so, I We'll talk about this a little

[21:15] bit more. I think there are a lot of

[21:17] ways in which this exercise is like our

[21:20] process, right? We are really compelled

[21:22] by these students. I hope you can see

[21:25] the sort of like joy we have in

[21:27] presenting students to our admission

[21:28] committee. We recognize

[21:31] incredible strengths within all of our

[21:33] applicants, and it's really our job to

[21:35] lift those up and to think about again

[21:37] who a student will be when they get to

[21:38] our campus community. The ways in which

[21:41] And there are numerous ways in which

[21:43] this is not like our admission

[21:45] committee, right? We never have three

[21:47] students

[21:48] and one place in the class. We make

[21:51] individual decisions about each

[21:53] applicant based on what we think is best

[21:55] for our institution and what we think is

[21:57] best for that student, and then we move

[22:00] on, right? And so, for me at Haverford,

[22:03] not at Macalester,

[22:05] in order to be admitted, you would go

[22:07] through a consensus-based admission

[22:09] committee discussion. So, there's no

[22:11] vote.

[22:12] It's really sort of a sense of the room

[22:13] or a sense of the meeting. And that's

[22:15] how decisions unfold, but would love to

[22:17] hear a little bit more about Bates and

[22:20] Vassar.

[22:23] Yeah, Bates does not follow

[22:25] consensus-based decision-making, though

[22:27] that sounds incredibly lovely.

[22:29] We follow

[22:31] a committee-based evaluation process

[22:33] where

[22:34] a committee with a larger group of the

[22:37] of the staff, maybe six people, maybe 12

[22:39] people, a majority vote will be placed,

[22:42] but that's not a final vote, and and by

[22:44] all means,

[22:46] applications are seen again and again

[22:47] throughout the multiple weeks of of

[22:49] decision-making.

[22:53] Sure, at Vassar, we do an individual

[22:55] review first, and then it goes to either

[22:58] a second read, or it goes to committee,

[23:01] or sometimes both of those things, and

[23:03] we we really try to make sure there are

[23:05] many eyes on an applicant. But, you

[23:07] know, we all have our personal

[23:09] attachments to people. You know, my job

[23:11] is to be an advocate for the students

[23:12] that I review. And so, when I bring them

[23:15] to committee, I'm really trying to, you

[23:17] know, give an unbiased assessment, but

[23:19] at the same time, we're humans. That's,

[23:21] you know, this is a very human process,

[23:23] but you're also human, so we're trying

[23:24] to match that energy as much as

[23:26] possible. We all come in with our own

[23:28] biases, and I think that's why we have

[23:30] multiple voices in the room is to make

[23:31] sure we're checking each other. You

[23:33] know, for example, I was a theater

[23:34] [snorts] kid in high school. I never

[23:36] played sports. It's a little bit harder

[23:38] sometimes for me to connect to that.

[23:40] But, that's why I have a team that, you

[23:42] know, is made up of a bunch of different

[23:44] people with different viewpoints, so

[23:45] that they can make sure that I'm not

[23:47] bringing every theater kid to Vassar.

[23:50] >> [laughter]

[23:51] >> But, you know, making sure that we have

[23:52] a well-balanced class. But, you know,

[23:54] the in conversations are really

[23:55] important that we have in these

[23:57] committees. You know, it's making sure

[23:58] that we're keeping close to the mission,

[24:01] and that we are bringing in an

[24:02] interesting and diverse community to our

[24:04] campus each year.

[24:09] Awesome. Well,

[24:11] the verdict is in, and the majority have

[24:16] decided that Eshan is admitted.

[24:20] >> [laughter]

[24:21] >> And then, the majority waitlist choice

[24:24] is Anne.

[24:26] And the majority choice for the deny is

[24:30] David.

[24:32] Aw.

[24:33] >> [laughter]

[24:35] >> And I And we are seeing some comments in

[24:37] the chat, you know, definitely there

[24:39] were a few things that I think resonated

[24:41] with people about, you know, the

[24:44] supplemental essay being not about the

[24:46] question, maybe, and definitely some I

[24:49] AI questions, maybe.

[24:51] Um Do you all have comments on any of

[24:54] those things?

[24:57] Um sure, yeah. Um, I I think uh one

[25:01] thing I'm I'm glad that you're

[25:03] resonating with the value of the

[25:05] supplements, right? Um, because I would

[25:07] I would put it this way, if any college

[25:09] or university has a supplemental

[25:11] question, I promise they've spent an

[25:13] enormous amount of time thinking about

[25:15] it. There are an infinite number of

[25:17] questions that could be asked, and the

[25:18] college or university has asked you one

[25:21] or two or I think Stanford has like 10,

[25:23] but um

[25:24] but right, they've asked you

[25:26] purposefully um what if for you to

[25:28] answer that question. Um and it's

[25:31] really, really helpful to have your

[25:34] voice come through in those responses.

[25:37] Um

[25:38] we think a lot about who we're building,

[25:42] uh the kind of community we're building

[25:43] on our campuses, and often times the

[25:46] supplemental responses can and in my

[25:49] committee conversations can really move

[25:50] the needle. When we're having a hard

[25:52] time reaching consensus, we'll read

[25:53] through your supplements aloud. I'll do

[25:55] my best to advocate for you. There is no

[25:57] better advocate for you than you, right?

[26:00] So see the supplements, you're putting

[26:02] in an enormous amount of time and energy

[26:04] and effort to this process. See the

[26:06] supplements as a way for you to show

[26:08] your work. And I'll tell you, this past

[26:10] year um

[26:12] the supplemental responses that we

[26:14] received, um you know, there it became

[26:17] really clear uh the students who leaned

[26:20] on AI and lost their voice in the

[26:23] process um because we're not just

[26:26] reading your application each day, we're

[26:27] reading a few dozen applications a day

[26:30] perhaps. Um and

[26:33] uh what is an authentic reflection

[26:35] versus what is a uh AI generated

[26:38] reflection becomes clear. Um and it's

[26:41] just a bummer to not have the

[26:42] opportunity to hear from you and to give

[26:44] you the space to advocate for yourself.

[26:46] So

[26:47] um I'm sure my colleagues have things to

[26:49] add, but just really want to lift up

[26:50] that idea of authenticity. Um, not that

[26:53] you can't use AI, but make sure that uh

[26:56] your voice is very much still coming

[26:58] through. That if someone read it, um,

[27:00] they would know that you wrote it.

[27:05] I'll just add, you know, about that

[27:06] authenticity and your voice. There's

[27:08] There's a lot of places in the

[27:09] application where you can add that. Um,

[27:11] you know, but thinking about the stuff

[27:12] you can't necessarily control, um,

[27:14] that's your transcript. The work has

[27:16] been done. Um, and you can't necessarily

[27:18] read your teacher recommendations or

[27:20] your counselor recommendations, so you

[27:21] don't always have control of that. The

[27:23] things you have control over are those

[27:25] written responses, um, both the main

[27:27] essay and that supplement, um, an

[27:29] initial view interview, or how you're

[27:31] interacting with the college. Um, those

[27:33] are all very important and again can add

[27:35] to that authenticity and really show

[27:36] your voice in the application process.

[27:38] And once again, this is a very human

[27:40] process where humans are reviewing your

[27:41] application, but also, um, we want you

[27:44] to be kind of your full self on our

[27:46] campus and we're trying to make sure

[27:47] that our community has, um, you know,

[27:50] interesting vibe to it. Um, and so, um,

[27:53] you know, when we can really hear who

[27:55] you are and see who you are, um, you

[27:57] know, and they go again, those are the

[27:59] things you can really control in the

[28:00] application. Make sure you're you're

[28:02] really telling us, um, in an authentic

[28:04] way who you are and who you'll be here

[28:05] on our campus.

[28:12] Great. Well, any other, um,

[28:14] thoughts,

[28:16] uh, admissions officers,

[28:18] um, about kind of this exercise?

[28:22] And for everybody watching, do you have

[28:25] questions? Like, how, you know, what are

[28:27] your final questions? I'm going to stop

[28:29] sharing so people can see all our faces

[28:31] in this discussion.

[28:32] >> [laughter]

[28:36] >> I think something that, um, I mean, has

[28:38] also been highlighted through the

[28:39] comments is, um,

[28:41] that the tennis coach in the call uh may

[28:43] have sealed the deal. Uh, and that I I

[28:45] think it's important to just highlight

[28:47] how like many many factors go into an

[28:49] admission decision. It's not just going

[28:52] to be academics. It's definitely not

[28:54] just the SAT score. It's not just where

[28:57] you go to high school. It's not just who

[28:59] you are and what you bring to the

[29:00] community. It's everything that we

[29:02] discussed and then some, right? And some

[29:05] decisions

[29:06] and some factors are way beyond your

[29:09] control

[29:10] and and and and rely on what the

[29:12] institution is looking for at the time

[29:14] and

[29:16] what we're trying to build in our

[29:17] community. Imagine if McCollough Bot

[29:19] didn't have a tennis team, right? That

[29:22] these conversations would have just been

[29:23] completely erased, right? And

[29:26] Yushan wouldn't wouldn't have been that

[29:28] person who is highlighted through maybe

[29:30] his specific impact in a tennis team,

[29:33] right? So what would have been the

[29:35] decision at the time, right? So there's

[29:36] a lot of things that go into play

[29:38] and and I just want to recognize that

[29:40] there's things that you have in your

[29:41] control that you can build a strong

[29:43] application for. And there's also things

[29:44] that just are a matter of what the

[29:47] institution is looking for, what the

[29:49] admission committee is focused on, and

[29:52] and and seeing you not only as an

[29:54] individual who can contribute wonders in

[29:56] our communities, but also seeing you as

[29:57] part of our mosaic that we're trying to

[29:59] build with the 500, 800, 1,000 other

[30:02] people that we're trying to bring each

[30:04] year.

[30:08] I also just add like, you know, the word

[30:10] fit comes up a lot in the admission

[30:12] process and I think that's important.

[30:14] You want to make sure when you're

[30:15] building your list of colleges to apply

[30:17] to that these are places that might be a

[30:20] good fit for you, but you know, fit

[30:21] means a lot of different things.

[30:23] Sometimes it's do you speak to the

[30:24] mission of the college? Are you someone

[30:26] who wants to be a community builder like

[30:28] at McCollough Bot?

[30:29] Are you a good fit for the academic

[30:31] programs there? So make sure that when

[30:33] you're applying to colleges that you

[30:35] kind of think about that in the process

[30:36] and if you fit. But at the same time I

[30:38] think all of us are trying to make sure

[30:40] that our communities don't become

[30:41] stagnant either. You know, we want

[30:43] people who um in some ways fit the

[30:45] college but also some cases like don't

[30:47] quite fit and maybe will challenge our

[30:49] communities as well. Um so, you know,

[30:51] make sure that that doesn't dictate

[30:53] everything um and that you're really

[30:55] thinking about a place that feels like

[30:57] home to you uh for the next few years

[30:59] and feels like the people around you

[31:01] will be your friends and your

[31:02] colleagues.

[31:04] That's a really great thing to be

[31:05] bringing up Jackie because next week

[31:07] we're having a specific Tuesday to talk

[31:10] about fit. Um so, and how to kind of

[31:13] research schools to be able to see um

[31:16] what that means for you as a student.

[31:18] So, definitely tune in then. Um

[31:21] we have some comments and questions

[31:22] about yields um and what that means in

[31:25] the decision-making process. Like how

[31:27] much does that weigh into kind of your

[31:29] conversations? Is that like a

[31:32] conversation that happens earlier on in

[31:34] the read or is it something later, you

[31:36] know?

[31:37] Any comments about you know, determining

[31:40] trying to guess if a student is going to

[31:41] come or not and how that plays in.

[31:44] I'll I'll answer very quickly at least

[31:46] for a place like Vassar. We do not take

[31:48] demonstrated interest into account. So,

[31:50] that's not necessarily a major factor.

[31:53] Whether somebody attended a college fair

[31:55] or program, um it's nice to see but it's

[31:57] not going to affect our decision but

[31:59] somewhere along the line maybe in

[32:01] waitlist, that's where it might play a

[32:03] factor. Um so, I'll let my colleagues

[32:05] answer um if if maybe they have a

[32:07] different experience at their

[32:08] institution.

[32:11] I'm happy to to jump in in terms of the

[32:13] um Haverford approach. I think the first

[32:15] thing to say is um we take it seriously

[32:18] if you've chosen to apply to Haverford

[32:20] or any of our colleges, right? Um we

[32:22] hope you're not applying to more than 10

[32:25] or 12 college and universities. We hope

[32:28] and know that was an intentional choice.

[32:30] Um so, the application is a strong

[32:32] demonstration of of interest and I want

[32:34] to be clear about that. Um but uh the

[32:38] the sort of we think about demonstrated

[32:40] interest, I would say in a qualitative

[32:41] way. So, there's not a formula for us.

[32:45] Um, it's really thinking, um, with your

[32:47] supplement, uh, about how you've

[32:49] engaged, um, with us, um, how you

[32:52] thought about and articulated why of

[32:55] the, you know, 4,000 colleges and

[32:57] universities in the United States, let

[32:58] alone the thousands of colleges across

[33:00] the globe, Haverford is one of the

[33:01] places you've chosen to apply. And then,

[33:04] um, you know, an interview, um, whether

[33:06] it's via InitialView, whether it's,

[33:09] um, via our alumni, um, or other

[33:13] outlets, that can also be a really

[33:15] helpful way of demonstrating interest.

[33:18] Um, you're engaging with another person,

[33:21] you're sharing a bit more about who you

[33:22] are and what you value, and we've talked

[33:24] a lot about authenticity, right? And

[33:26] that's the interview can be another

[33:28] place, um, for that authenticity, which

[33:31] often then aligns with this idea of

[33:33] demonstrating understanding,

[33:35] demonstrating interest in our college or

[33:37] university. So, it's It is, um, it is a

[33:40] factor, but not in the way I think most

[33:42] people think it is. Like Jackie said,

[33:43] we're not sort of checking boxes for

[33:45] your engagement. It's really about your

[33:47] ability to tell us, "I've done my

[33:49] research. I see myself here, and this is

[33:51] why." Um, and that's really, really, uh,

[33:53] a fun part of our process, for sure.

[34:00] Awesome.

[34:01] Um, okay, and we have some questions

[34:03] about testing, test optional. So, if,

[34:07] um, you know, we noticed David didn't

[34:10] submit an SAT or ACT, but did submit AP

[34:13] scores. So,

[34:14] you know, what level of score would you

[34:17] recommend? Like, I mean, we didn't talk

[34:18] about that too much in kind of

[34:21] in committee,

[34:23] >> [laughter]

[34:23] >> about how that score could have been

[34:26] talked about. So,

[34:29] maybe any thoughts on whether or not AP

[34:32] exams should be reported, when they

[34:35] should be reported, does it play into

[34:37] the conversation?

[34:39] Yeah.

[34:40] Um, I appreciate that and not to steal

[34:43] cats uh

[34:44] very much trademark phrase, but it

[34:46] depends on the institution

[34:48] >> [laughter]

[34:48] >> uh and

[34:49] how we

[34:50] >> Every Tuesday talk, always we have

[34:53] answers.

[34:53] >> [laughter]

[34:53] >> It depends. Sounds like a t-shirt,

[34:55] Gloria.

[34:58] Uh but I think it depends, right? It

[35:00] depends on the institution how much they

[35:01] value those scores. Um, I know of

[35:04] institutions that require

[35:06] uh applicants, if they've taken an AP

[35:08] test, to submit those scores um and and

[35:10] and they're part of the review process.

[35:13] Um, for Bates, uh we welcome the AP test

[35:15] scores, but they're not going to be uh

[35:18] sort of influencing the academic profile

[35:20] as much as what your actual grades in

[35:23] those classes were. Uh because, you

[35:25] know, the the reality is that we use the

[35:27] AP test scores mostly to um the after

[35:30] the admission process as part of the

[35:32] transfer credit policy that we're

[35:34] allowed to have um at Bates. You know,

[35:36] students can bring up to four credits of

[35:39] um college level classes that they took

[35:40] in high school, including AP scores uh

[35:43] or AP test uh any classes um into their

[35:45] Bates curriculum, right?

[35:48] What I feel about testing in general um

[35:50] is that um it is an important data point

[35:53] and any data point in our

[35:55] um in our um review process is going to

[35:57] be important, but it's not the only data

[35:59] point that's important, right? Um and we

[36:02] value so much more three and a half

[36:06] years of a high school experience than

[36:08] three and a half hours on a Saturday

[36:10] morning. Um and that goes for AP tests

[36:14] as well as as SAT and ACT tests.

[36:18] Um SATs and ACTs,

[36:21] we've been able to see how they can be

[36:23] useful in many cases, but they're not

[36:25] indicative of student success. Uh Bates

[36:27] did a study a few years ago where they

[36:29] split the class into two groups, one who

[36:31] applied with testing and one who applied

[36:33] without testing, and we sort of recorded

[36:35] their GPAs across all four years at

[36:37] Bates, and after their four years at

[36:39] Bates, we saw the difference in their

[36:40] collective GPAs was just of 0.01%

[36:44] 0.01 in their two GPAs. So, telling you

[36:47] that it's completely insignificant

[36:50] and and and it doesn't tell us whether a

[36:51] student will be more or less successful

[36:54] in college.

[36:56] I'll also note as we're seeing more and

[36:58] more colleges are going back to test

[36:59] required.

[37:01] And that tells you a lot about how an an

[37:03] institution views their application

[37:05] process and what they really value. So,

[37:06] just food for thought as you're sort of

[37:07] making the decisions on where to apply

[37:10] and and how to submit your application.

[37:12] You should rest assured that the very

[37:14] least the three colleges that are here

[37:16] and those who say that they're test

[37:17] optional, we rely on a true test

[37:19] optional policy, right? If you do not

[37:21] submit testing as Jackie said earlier,

[37:23] we do not penalize you in any way. It's

[37:26] not going to be a question as to why you

[37:28] didn't submit testing.

[37:30] If you do submit testing, that's when we

[37:32] consider the score for better and for

[37:34] worse. And that's for Bates specific. I

[37:35] know other colleges do just if it helps

[37:37] your application, just like that, right?

[37:39] But it's a true test optional policy.

[37:42] And I would just add, you know, test

[37:44] optional often refers to the SAT and

[37:46] ACT, and there's typically a separate

[37:47] policy listed on a college's website for

[37:50] English proficiency scores. So, make

[37:52] sure that you're also looking up that

[37:54] policy cuz just saying, "Oh, I'm going

[37:56] to be test optional and not send my

[37:58] SAT." You may still have to send English

[38:00] proficiency scores or not, but make sure

[38:02] you're checking that policy as well

[38:03] because that will be a little bit

[38:05] different.

[38:06] And the last thing to say on this

[38:07] question, and I'm sorry this is going to

[38:09] sound like I'm on a soapbox, but I am.

[38:13] If you are not in an AP curriculum, if

[38:16] you are not taking that AP class, please

[38:19] do not to the AP test.

[38:22] You there are so many better ways for

[38:24] you to spend your time and I'm including

[38:27] sleeping in that, right? [laughter] So,

[38:30] we are not expecting students who are in

[38:32] different curriculum to be taking

[38:35] tests that don't align with the

[38:37] curriculum that's offered at their high

[38:38] school.

[38:39] And I hope that's something that you're

[38:41] hearing again and again, but just wanted

[38:44] to be really clear about that.

[38:46] And if you're taking AP exams this week,

[38:48] good luck. Ciao. I didn't [laughter] say

[38:50] it right, but that's good enough. No,

[38:52] you said it right. Good job. Good job.

[38:54] Okay, [clears throat] well, we only have

[38:56] a couple more minutes. So,

[38:57] there's a couple more questions and so I

[38:59] just want to share

[39:01] the contact slide so that if you have a

[39:05] specific question for a specific

[39:06] college, please reach out. That's why we

[39:08] have these

[39:10] and we will talk about some of these

[39:11] questions I didn't cover next week as

[39:13] well.

[39:15] Um

[39:16] but I do want to ask you all

[39:21] to give you just a chance because there

[39:23] was a question like how is a compelling

[39:25] applicant changing at your institutions

[39:28] over the years.

[39:30] So, if you could just share a little bit

[39:32] about how you see that at your

[39:34] institution as kind of a closing thought

[39:36] and an encouraging word, that would be

[39:38] awesome and I'm mindful of the time. So,

[39:41] you guys you know what I [snorts] mean.

[39:43] >> [laughter]

[39:45] >> How we see Sorry, can you repeat the the

[39:47] question? I was encouraging Justin in

[39:49] his uh AP

[39:50] >> [laughter]

[39:50] >> test.

[39:52] How have you seen a compelling applicant

[39:55] change over the years for you

[39:58] specifically for your institution? Like

[40:00] what do you see as compelling?

[40:05] That's a good question.

[40:08] I think so, in the age of AI and the age

[40:11] of just a lot of things that are able to

[40:14] be fabricated or deeply edited,

[40:16] authenticity for me is key. Seeing a

[40:18] student be a 17-year-old, be themselves,

[40:21] have their voice shown in their

[40:22] application as their own is so impactful

[40:25] and so deeply appreciative. So, more and

[40:27] more I'm seeing myself lean into that

[40:30] authenticity and being able to sort of

[40:32] like verify that a student is who they

[40:33] are and and and a student is sort of

[40:35] that 17-year-old, 18-year-old applying

[40:36] to college.

[40:42] I would kind of add the same thing. I've

[40:44] been doing this I was trying to do the

[40:46] math I think almost 15 years at this

[40:48] point.

[40:49] And you know, there's in some ways less

[40:51] data points over the last few years. You

[40:53] know, I'm not seeing testing as often.

[40:55] I'm not seeing seeing rank as often in

[40:57] many schools.

[40:58] And that's all fine. And so I think the

[41:00] things again that the students can

[41:01] control have become even more important.

[41:04] I would also say over the last probably

[41:06] three or four years that connection to

[41:08] the mission of a college has become more

[41:09] important as well. Again, sometimes it

[41:11] goes back to data points whereas in the

[41:13] US where we're seeing less data points

[41:15] for a student's demographic information.

[41:17] And so we're thinking about how they

[41:19] align with our mission in a very deep

[41:21] way and that's really when we do

[41:23] training for our application readers.

[41:25] That's a really big part of what we

[41:27] train for. And so again, I think a

[41:29] student's fit in our community, I think

[41:31] a student's voice have become even more

[41:33] important in the last few years.

[41:36] Awesome.

[41:37] I couldn't say it better than either of

[41:39] my colleagues. So, maybe I'll I'll leave

[41:41] you with this thought.

[41:43] And especially for the students, but for

[41:45] the counselors and parents and

[41:46] guardians,

[41:48] the admission decision a student

[41:49] receives whether it's the one that they

[41:51] wanted or not is in no way, shape, or

[41:53] form a reflection of your worth or value

[41:56] as a person. It's just not. These were

[41:58] three fantastic students.

[42:00] We cared about them. We saw them as

[42:03] wonderful additions to our community and

[42:06] they got different decisions, right? So,

[42:08] I hope students you're finding joy in

[42:10] this process of discovering who you are

[42:12] and what you seek in your next college

[42:14] or university or in your next

[42:15] institution and that you're also growing

[42:17] in confidence that whatever college or

[42:19] university you choose to join will be

[42:21] all the better for your presence because

[42:23] it absolutely will be, right? And so I

[42:25] hope that's something you're able to

[42:27] hold on to, share with your friends um

[42:29] and uh and lift one another up through

[42:32] this process, too.

[42:35] Yay, thank you so much. This was

[42:37] awesome. Thank you again for joining and

[42:40] taking time out of your busy schedule.

[42:41] Thank you everyone else for tuning in.

[42:43] We'll